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Eschatology Issues XII:

Babylon, Armageddon, Israel, 2026.

Word RTF

Question #1:

Good morning Dr.,

I pray everything is well with you and your family. I have quick question. I am still reading CT5 and on the section related to Christ 2nd Advent with the appearance of His army. I know the battle is the Lord. Christ will personally destroy the armies of Armageddon.

Two questions:

1) will this be an instantaneous event? I know all He has to do is speak a word and they are destroyed or will Christ make it prolonged? Basically, how long will the destruction take?

2) what will be the role of His army while Christ is destroying His enemies. I know the His rule will be immediate and we will be there to rule with Him as soon as He is victorious. But will we be waiting in the air until His work is accomplished?

Thank you Bob and excellent work. I am about to conclude CT5 and start on CT6.

God bless you in Christ Jesus.

Response #1:

Great to hear from you as always, my friend. As to your questions, Armageddon will be swift but not instantaneous. Our Lord will proceed from one end of antichrist's army to the other destroying them all, one by one. Here is a link to the chart which tracks His movements on that day according to what we can glean from a variety of scriptures: "The Winepress of Armageddon".

As to our role, that is, the Church marshaled around Him after the resurrection, my conclusion based upon a number of scriptures which point in that direction is that our participation in the battle will be concerned not with the human army of antichrist (which our Lord destroys entirely on His own), but with the rounding up of the fallen angels for their millennial incarceration; see the link: "Participation of Resurrected Believers".

Thanks as always for your good words and encouragement!

In Jesus Christ our dear Lord and Savior,

Bob L.

Question #2:

I am not a scholar, nor did I come to fight with you, I was doing research on the star of moleck myself. I don’t just listen to the pastor, I came across your site and, Sir ye do error. the star is a star symbol used to worship the heavenly host, google it, do reading research. Don’t make anyone a two fold child of the devil, souls are at stake, eternity, forever, no do overs. Please don’t be offended Proverbs 27:17 Iron sharpeneth iron; so a man sharpeneth the countenance of his friend.

Response: One thing I can say with dogmatism about Acts 7:43 is that the star is not the star of David. For one thing, the star of David as a Jewish national symbol is a fairly recent invention (not much older than the USA), and there is, as far as I know, nothing in the archaeological artifacts or texts from the days of ancient Israel to suggest that the six-pointed star symbol was even in existence prior to the modern era (let alone being an important ancient symbol).

This symbol shown below is very much older than the USA, Many would agree. look at the dollar, the star is rich in demonic rituals the 5 & 6 pointed, look at the constellations of the planets, Saturn and other planets in the solar system in picture below.

Brother please do your homework, you are defending a lie, the star of Moleck been around much longer than America and if you think that because it is a national symbol it is ok? jewish people in Israel now are converts Ashkenazi, and just say for Pete’s sake they are real Israelites, where are the other 11 tribes? they were one race plus a there were a mixed multitude says Exodus 12: 37 And the children of Israel journeyed from Rameses to Succoth, about six hundred thousand on foot that were men, beside children. 38 And a mixed multitude went up also with them; and flocks, and herds, even very much cattle. 39 And they baked unleavened cakes of the dough which they brought forth out of Egypt, for it was not leavened; because they were thrust out of Egypt, and could not tarry, neither had they prepared for themselves any victual This is going to be hard to swallow but the is harder to understand than traditional lies, study to show yourself approved, don’t buy lies of the devil and be dogmatic about what you don’t understand:

Proverbs 4:7 Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding.

Revelation 3:9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

Revelation 2:9 I know your afflictions and your poverty--yet you are rich! I know about the slander of those who say they are Jews and are not, but are a synagogue of Satan.

Response #2:

Dear Friend,

First, on your misuse of the verses in Revelation, please see the link: "An Explanation of the passages 'those who say they are Jews but are not' (in CT 2A)".

With respect, you could not have read the entirety of these postings on this subject. The purpose of these postings – obvious even from the quote included – is to disabuse readers of the notion that the so-called star of David and the star mentioned at acts 7:43 are the same star. They are not the same star. The purpose is not to say anything definitive about the magen David or about Molech worship or about the supposedly "lost" ten tribes or about the Illuminati or, or, or. The purpose is to demonstrate that in the Bible there is no magen David, and that there is no biblical evidence to connect the modern day symbol to the reference in Acts/Amos. Those interrelated points are irrefutable, but in discussions of this sort they are most often passed over in a rush to pore over photos posted on the internet; feel free to do so, but that is not my purpose in posting this material.

This is a Bible teaching ministry. If you wish to discuss this issue, first please read the posts in their entirety (links below); then, please provide biblical evidence that would somehow link the star of Amos/Acts with the six-point star of the magen David. What I find in the case of most people who get exercised about this issue is a swift recourse to internet lore, questionable archaeology, and latent anti-Semitism. All these things are beside the point and result in "getting off into the weeds" as far as I am concerned. Personally, I have no intrinsic interest in the star of David or its origins or possible conspiracy theories. My interests are biblical, and my purpose on this particular issue is to make it clear that there is no genuine connection in the Bible between Acts 7:43 and the six-pointed star which is to be found, e.g., on the flag of the secular state of Israel. I am not convinced that it would mean anything for my purposes of teaching the Bible if there were a demonstrable connection; but I am saying that I see nothing in scripture to describe the star in Acts 7:43 / Amos 5:25-27 in terms which would allow for that identification. I will go further and say that I know of no legitimate archaeological evidence regarding this biblical citation which would give us any clue as to the biblically mentioned star's original appearance; and finally even if it could be demonstrated that it were six pointed that would not affect any biblical interpretation or biblical doctrine of which I am aware. My main concern in this is that the "star issue" has become a gateway for conspiracy theories which have nothing to do with the Bible or with walking a good walk with Jesus Christ. Even if what you and others said were to be 100% true and verifiable, it would do a dedicated Christian no good to have that information; it would only be a temptation to immerse oneself in conspiracy theories and fringe politics; and getting involved in politics, any politics, is always a bad idea for believers who want to please Jesus Christ – because it amounts to playing the devil's game (whichever "side" one chooses).

In other words, for true Christians this issue is irrelevant, and that would be true even if your representations were correct and my information incorrect (which I certainly do not concede). What I find most disturbing about your email to me is your willingness to link eternal salvation to one's understanding of the star of David!!! All born again Christians are saved by faith in Jesus Christ; all who rely on any sort of legalism or quasi-political doctrines or ritual of any kind and do not have faith in Christ are not saved. It is all about Jesus Christ; it is all about faith in Him, His perfect Person, His work in dying for our sins on the cross. Getting side-tracked by false issues such as this is a big mistake for any Christian. Being in anyway involved in leading others into such spiritual defiles is bound to have horrific consequences, in this life and in the next. I would advise you to turn aside from such false issues and devote yourself to the truth of the Word of God instead.

Here are those "required reading" links necessary to first digest if you wish to pursue this further:

Is the star of Acts 7:43 the star of David?

The star of David again

Molech and the star of David?


Acts 7:43 and the Sefer Yetzirah

Israel, 'Lost Tribes' and the Star of David

In Jesus Christ our Lord who is the only Way of Salvation,

Bob Luginbill

Question #3:

You are questioning my Christianity? getting off track? wow are you who you say you are? only Christ can judge my heart, be careful when you think you stand lest you fall. I am a born again Christian and I love the Lord, With attacks like that you will be lacking true Christian friends, for true Christians it is very important, I don’t want an idol or something representing a false god on my neck or in my house, wood crosses, or stone idols or the likes. And Christianity should be in the political arena, who were the original law givers? Christens, We are the salt of the earth, the problem is church and state took it’s savor and knowledge of subduing and bringing everything subject to Christ. Also since you say the stars are not the same in Acts /Amos do you have a picture or biblical proof they are different? or bible discretion no, but the worshiping of stars is condemned in the scriptures, also they are used by the enemy, both stars. I am not giving credit to the devil but his crew must have used the stars in Egypt and the Israelites picked up the craft and God got upset at them, looking at carvings and images from the caves and pyramids also hieroglyphs they were used and are still being used today by the same enemy crews. Brother I don’t want to argue, but there is nothing new under the sun. I don’t intend to lead anyone into defilement, the only false issue is to think you know it all, now that has a greater consequence. Beside you posted the long page. I would advise you to keep from suchlike issues if you can’t do simple compares and contrasts between what the devil used then and now, and stop leading people in such serious blindness because the bible doesn’t show you a picture of the stars, the enemy uses them and that should be enough. Obedience is better than sacrifice, God gave instructions in Deuteronomy of how to make the flag of Israel it’s didn’t include a star, and lastly I am not an anti-Semite because the jewish Ashkenazi converts are not of the tribe of Simeon, you are calling the wrong people Israel, unlimit yourself and do research, don’t be afraid to find the truth, research Ashkenazi, and then apply Deuteronomy 28 to every known race and be honest, all the curses must match exactly, God don’t lie. Also I will not comment any longer on the subject. Thanks for your time.

Response #3:

Dear Friend,

With all due respect, it seems that not only have you not read the postings, but you have not read my reply to you either (at least not carefully enough to get what I am saying – apologies if I did not make myself clear enough).

*The star in Amos and the star in Acts is one and the same star (as I have said).

*However, there is no biblical evidence to identify either with the magen David.

No one is defending paganism. You have my support in condemning it. What I have a problem with is making the logical leap of saying: "because star worship is paganism in Amos/Acts, therefore the star of David is devil-worship". Not only is that so illogical as to be unworthy of serious comment but it also lends itself to anti-Semitism. Next thing you know, people are talking about the Illuminati and the "ten lost tribes" the "elders of Zion" and all sorts of other very dangerous rubbish. If people want to wallow in rubbish, that's their business. However, as a teacher of the Bible I cannot allow any Christian with any contact with this ministry to entertain the idea that anything anti-Semitic is somehow not horrifically dangerous to their spirituality – because it is (please see the link).

Please note: apart from there being absolutely no legitimate archaeological or historical evidence for the false connection you support, it is also superfluous for believers today who are trying to learn the truth of scripture to have to "identify" ancient pagan symbols in the world today. Beyond all argument, symbols are only important if they symbolize "something" to "someone"; so even if there were any truth to the theories one finds on the internet about the dollar bill, for example, it doesn't mean believers are damned for paying in cash. These symbols mean nothing to us, and it is purely academic if they really do mean what is claimed for others. I do know a little something about the state of Israel, and I can tell you that most of the Jewish population is composed either of individuals who are entirely secular or who are orthodox; neither group has anything whatsoever to do with paganism in its historical, idol-worshiping manifestations. And, after all, there are stars on the U.S. flag – and stars have been pagan symbols in the past. Certainly we are not to be accused of idolatry for saluting the flag.

As I say, there is much more at the links given already (and in my previous email could, apparently, benefit you if you would give it a second read-through), if you are really interested in the truth.

Salvation is through faith in Christ alone – there is no racial element to it.

Yours in the dear Lord Jesus who died for us all,

Bob L.

Question #4:

Hey Dr. Luginbill,

Do you think that every single Jewish person will be saved? You know, like all of Israel? What do you think of Zionism? Do you think what Israel is doing to the Palestinians is wrong? I promise these aren't leading questions. I just want to know your biblical view of the situation.

I need some really good advice on this next subject. How do I keep a good mood? Sometimes, I will read something and it will get me so upset. Or other times, I hear bad news, and it's completely demoralizing. For a while, I had kind of gotten to the point that I flatly refused to listen to anyone saying anything that could possibly bring me down. It's almost impossible to avoid though. Everything is all bad. Good people are 1 in 100 if even. Something happens though, and it's like why even bother. I honestly don't think that we could ever effect real change in this world. I used to be a big believer in people. Now, I think people are basically bad. I knew from a Christian standpoint that we are born in sin. It's just another thing to see it with your own two eyes that people are intrinsically evil. Our only saving grace is God. Can you please give me some encouragement?

Thanks,

Response #4:

Good to hear from you.

As to your questions, Zionism is a political movement that has nothing to do with the Bible. Certainly, God is moving all the "pieces on the chessboard" inexorably towards the end times, but He often uses the actions of unbelieving human beings to accomplish His greater purposes (He even makes use of evil spirits, after all; see the link). As to Israel, as Paul remarks, "they are not all Israel who are of Israel" (Rom.9:6b NKJV), meaning that only those who share the faith of Abraham and believe in Christ are "the Israel of God" (Gal.6:16). In every generation of the Church there is a "remnant according to the election of grace" (Rom.11:5), meaning that there are always Jews who believe. But since our Lord's day and until His return, "this generation" of hardness has and will continue to be the rule (Rom.11:25). The nation of Israel is a secular state and contains very few believers (if there are any, they have no part in governing that nation). How our country deals with other countries, Israel included, is therefore largely a political question (and as you know I make it my practice to steer clear of politics as much as possible). The one caveat here is that the Jewish people, even unbelievers, are a special target of the devil, and therefore Jews individually and also collectively often come in for as much persecution as Satan can muster. Persecuting anyone innocent for any reason is abominable to the Lord, but no one who becomes involved in any anti-Semitic activity will fail to receive horrific recompense: just ask Nazi Germany. Please see the links:

Israelology, Anti-Semitism, Lost Tribes

Some Jewish Issues

Zionism

Satan's Attack on the Line of Messiah

Who is True Israel?

Are the Celts the Ten Lost Tribes of Israel?

Who are the Ten Lost Tribes of Israel?

Israel and Anti-Christ in Eschatology

To take this further into your next set of questions, as a student of history, I can certainly tell you that the negative side of mankind is always percolating beneath the surface and that "total depravity" as it is often called theologically is a truism. After all, even believers only are restrained and restrain themselves from sin out of a fear of God and a love of the Lord – when we do so (we all fail sometimes even so). Finding a good friend or a group of Christians who really are "salt of the earth" is a rare treasure, and I have certainly found in the course of my life that these very few individuals should not be taken for granted. The older one gets the more discerning one gets (or should) – and with greater discernment comes greater recognition of the flaws of others (and hopefully also of one's own!).

But God does provide. Cast your cares on Him. He can provide you with everything you genuinely need. And do please remember that this provision and blessing – and, critically, your capacity to recognize it, appreciate it, and enjoy it – are absolutely dependent on your continuing spiritual growth. It always comes back to that.

If you dedicate yourself to living your life for the Lord, to growing up and advancing where He leads, to passing the tests He brings your way, and to coming into the ministry He has planned for you for the sake of His Body the Church, then you will not fail to run into just the right people – genuine, dedicated Christians who like yourself love Jesus Christ more than life. This is a blessing which cannot be manufactured. Trust in the Lord and guide your steps accordingly and He will give you all the legitimate desire of your heart (Ps.37:4-5) – it all comes down to that too.

Yours in the Lord we love more than anything in this temporary world, Jesus Christ our dear Savior.

Bob L.

Question #5:

Hello! I find your website to be very thorough. Question: is it possible that the Great Apostasy already started? Particularly, on September 30, 2009. On this date, the international community started celebrating Blasphemy Day (please look on wikipedia for more information on blasphemy day).

Response #5:

Dear Friend,

Good to make your acquaintance, and thanks so much for your positive comments. Here is what I read in 2nd Thessalonians:

Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.
2nd Thessalonians 2:3-4

This demonstrates that the Great Apostasy itself is a tribulational event (linked directly here to the revelation of the beast), and one so obvious therein that Paul can use it as a sign or signal to show that the Day of the Lord, the second advent (and the Tribulation which constitutes is prelude), has not yet come (or begun).

I would certainly agree the trends which exemplify the Great Apostasy are already well in train. After all, this is the final Church era, the era of Laodicea (see the links), wherein lukewarmness is the rule, and any Christian who is not solid in his/her faith is ripe for apostasy when the pressure begins to amp up – that will definitely happen with the commencement of the Tribulation, and especially with the commencement of the Great Persecution in the Tribulation's second half, the so-called "Great Tribulation".

If you do not stand firm in your faith, you will not stand at all.
Isaiah 7:9b NIV

Those on the rocky ground are the ones who receive the word with joy when they hear it, but they have no root. They believe for a while, but in the time of testing they fall away (lit., "apostatize").
Luke 8:13 NIV

As to the link, while I would agree that respect for the Lord seems to be at all time low in our day, apostasy concerns genuine Christians who, under the pressures of this life, fall away completely from the faith: they once believed, but now do not. The Great Apostasy will see fully one third of genuine believers abandon their faith to follow antichrist. The absurdity of disturbing events like the one you link to while depressing and no doubt helping to set the stage for things to come is not really so much an indication of believers abandoning their faith as it is of the internationalization and unification of (false) religion, unbelief and anti-truth which will come to full fruition once the Tribulation begins. Please see the links:

The persuasiveness of the tribulational false religion

Characteristics of antichrist's religion

The Anti-Christian Religion and its Worldwide Expansion

The Great Apostasy

Yours in our dear Lord and Savior Jesus Christ – to whom we intend to be faithful even unto death.

Bob L.

Question #6:

Bob,

I recently came across your site and I thank God for the insight he has given you. Through the last few years, I have researched a lot of biblical principles and find myself disillusioned by the present day church.

In any case, I came across this possibility after reading a website that takes some of the antichrist related events to a rather unconventional level. Here is the idea proposed:

That the mark of the beast is in some form, immortality of the current sinful body; a desire so strong that everyone will want it. Essentially a fundamental transformation in our genetic make up by some kind of manipulation by the fallen angels, which is why God simply cannot redeem the ones who have so transformed. Can this explain why revelation says that in those days people will seek death but it will flee from them. Is there some other explanation for this verse Rev 9:6.

Or is this just an extra biblical revelation that is merely made up?

Thanks

Response #6:

Good to make your acquaintance – and thanks so much for your encouraging words.

As to your question, there is of course nothing in scripture which would necessitate this conclusion (obviously, no such notion would have been possible in the first century), because it is of course difficult to prove a negative (that is, that such a thing is impossible).

However, there are at least three factors which would lead me to reject this novel interpretation. The first is that the description of a literal mark in the manner or a tattoo or something similar given by John is very straightforward and difficult to explain away or to explain in some alternative manner. Here are some links wherein refutation of other such theories which founder on that same rock of interpretation may be found:

Mark and number of the beast

RFD chips and the mark

Computer chips and the mark

Biometry and the mark

Numbers, Letters, and the Mark of the Beast

and see also:

The Mark of the Beast (in CT 4)

Do not take the Mark of the Beast (in CT 7)

Secondly, if the mark represented something as attractive as actual deliverance from physical death, then in that case it is hard to see why the beast and his henchmen would need to put such a high price on not taking the mark, as in no buying or selling for those without it. Scripture seems universally to present the mark as mostly an intrusive thing which people will take as the path of least resistance as opposed to some "seemingly wonderful" boon; if the latter were the case, then one would think that antichrist would be able to achieve his goal very quickly without military conquest or the historically unprecedented coercion scripture actually relates.

Finally, as with all things, "the proof is in the pudding". It is all very well to promise immortality, but the Tribulation will be a time of unprecedented loss of life. The vast majority of the world's population will not survive; the fourth horseman indicates that death will be "at the door" throughout that seven year period (see the link). Since the number of persons with the mark who perish physically will be in the billions, and since those fatalities will doubtless commence just as soon as the first adherents of antichrist begin to take the mark, it seems to me that even if this false claim is made, recognition that it is a monstrous lie would follow almost instantaneously (thus rendering the exercise in propaganda pointless). After all, it is impossible for human beings, even ones backed by the devil, to avoid physical death. The only way out of the common destiny of mankind is the gospel: faith in the One who died for the sins of all that all might be saved and have eternal life, our dear Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

In Him,

Bob Luginbill

Question #7:

Good evening doctor. I hope this email finds you and your family on good spirits and health. I just finished reading CT6 and excellent analysis on the imminent reign of Christ and Eternity with the Father and Savior. This section had me hungering for his return and pronouncing "Maranatha, lord Jesus". Really great stuff. After reading CT you tend to feel like apostle Paul in Phil.1:21-23. I digress.

I have a question as it relates to an statement in CT 7 which I started today where you mentioned about being alert. How does someone who act in a guerrilla warfare against Anti-Christ apostatize? They have not taken the Mark and have not denied Christ. If that was the case, what is the difference between what they are doing versus the Jewish remnant who overtake temple from the Anti-Christ and fight against him prior to Chris's return?. If it is a matter of faith, in both instances there is a lack of faith, albeit the Jewish remnant are God's chosen instrument.

Can you please clarify the discrepancy. As always I appreciate your response and may Christ continue to fill you and your ministry with the power of the Holy Spirit.

Response #7:

Thanks so much for your kind words!

As to your question, it is a very good one. The Jewish rebels are not believers but, as you say, their actions are anticipated by the plan of God and He makes full use of them (as He and His plan do of absolutely everything, after all). The question for believers before this point is simply "what does Jesus want me to do?", and here I do not find anywhere in scripture any indication that anyone ought to fight the beast, or that anyone (besides the equally unbelieving southern alliance) does fight the beast. We do know ahead of time that all such efforts will be ineffective for the beast will rise to control the entire world – albeit temporarily (praise the Lord!). Beyond such action being a foreordained lost cause, there is also the potential for believers to find themselves in the wrong by so doing. After all, while a case can be made, I suppose, for some rebellions in some places in the course of human history (guerrilla uprisings by indigenous people in Nazi occupied countries, for example), here in this county it will not be a case of taking up arms against a foreign invader or even a colonial master; rather it will be a case of fighting the government chosen by the vast majority of the people. That strikes me not only as untenable but spiritually very questionable. While we find no scriptural encouragement to adopt such a course (just the opposite: Rom.13:4), the Bible has plenty to say about tribulational martyrdom and how we should conduct ourselves under these pressures. I would doubt that a person who has run off to the woods rather than stand up and admit that he/she is a believer in Jesus Christ would be a true martyr even if killed; the fact that he/she may have killed law enforcement or military personal who are duly authorized (albeit by an evil government) would not change that fact – and in my estimate of the situation would only make it worse. So while in some places at some times such action might be defensible and even heroic, all the evidence I see from scripture points the other way for the Tribulation – which is the most unique time in all of human history (with many unique circumstances requiring unusual responses on the part of believers: e.g., "flee Babylon"; see the link).

Yours in our dear Lord and Savior Jesus Christ,

Bob L.

Question #8:

Dr. Luginbill,

Do you have a teaching on the Jewish Wedding Ceremony and the Rapture? I heard a preacher/teacher claim the JWC is a clear picture of a pretrib rapture. I no longer believe in the pretrib rapture but I have family that are on the fence on this and so I need a very good explanation. Thank you so much and may God richly bless your work.

Response #8:

Good to hear from you again.

As to your question, I confess that my knowledge of Jewish cultural traditions is far from perfect. I will say that, as in Christian ceremonies, there are variations for different Jewish communities and specific traditions and at different time periods. In any case, none of these things are to be found in scripture. There is nothing in the Law which regulates the way in which wedding ceremonies are to be conducted. For that reason alone, Jewish wedding ceremonies, of whatever tradition or time period, are not probative in any way for doctrinal biblical issues. I find it somewhat ironic that pre-Trib rapture believers are reduced to drawing parallels with rituals that have no biblical basis. What I can say is that the biblical evidence for the truth that the resurrection of the Bride of Christ takes place when the Messiah returns – His parousia at the second advent – is, in my view, overwhelming. Here are the links at Ichthys where the matter is treated in detail:

Christ's Parousia is the Second Advent

When is the Rapture?

No Rapture

The Origin and the Danger of the Pre-Tribulational Rapture Theory

The Resurrection of the Lamb's Bride (in CT 5)

Yours in our dear Lord Jesus for whose return we breathlessly wait.

Bob L.

Question #9:

Hello Professor, how accurate are you with the dates of the seven churches of Revelation chapters two and three? Especially the 1882-2026 date (Laodicea).

Response #9:

As to your question, this is an interpretation of scripture, however I am very sure of the accuracy of the 2026 date, taking into account that there are certain assumptions required to produce this interpretation. Here is what I say about that in SR 5:

The most potentially controversial piece of information developed below, that is, the projected date for the commencement of the Tribulation, is based upon the following suppositions (all of which are treated within the context of this study):

The above points are all presented here as true, and the analysis upon which they are based is set forth below. Clearly, deviation from any of the above will alter the entire scheme. It is also true, as we have already said, that alteration of the schema presented below is certainly within the power and authority of the Almighty. The very end of the Tribulation, for example, will be shortened by some undisclosed amount of time (Mk.13:20). Rather than undermining the theory advanced in this study, however, Mark 13:20 in actuality supports the importance of paying heed to the Bible's chronological information. For if "the days are shortened", then surely this means that there was a definite heavenly timetable in the first place. Secondly, Mark 13:20 indicates that the shortening mentioned is a matter of days, weeks at the most (i.e., not enough to change the general time-line given below). This is certainly in line with the very specific tally of days and months given in Daniel and Revelation (Dan.7:25; 8:14; 12:7; 12:11-12; Rev.11:2-3; 12:6; 12:14; 13:5).

As to 1882, this and the other Church era dates are derived from giving 360 years (compare 360 days to the prophetical years of the Tribulation) to eras 2-6, with the first being considerably shorter (as an era of transition away from the time of the apostles – with one year for each apostle) and the last being shorter (less than half as long, with the significant number of 144; cf. the 144,000 who will come out of this era) as an era of degeneration which could not be allowed to continue for the full 360 years. Helpful in determining this schema were 1) the details of the Jewish ceremonial calendar and the significant numbering it contains (also a 360 day calendar with the number 144 also being significant therein; see the link); and 2) the spiritually significant historical events which bound the periods in question. Beyond this, the details may be found at the link in CT 2A: "Overview of the Seven Church Periods". So, yes, I am also fairly certain of the earlier date as well, although it is derivative to a larger degree than the first number which, if the assumptions listed above are correct, is also correct.

Yours in our dear Lord and Savior Jesus Christ for whom we so eagerly wait,

Bob L.

Question #10:

Hey Bill,

First I want to thank you for your response to my question on the Virtue Thinking from 2 Peter 1:3-11. It was a great help. You insight is greatly appreciated. I thank God that I came across your page years ago.

I wanted to ask a question based on the Tribulation. If 2026 holds correct and God does not call me home, I will be middle-aged at that time. Before I came on your site I had a desire to be a warrior for our Lord. Purely spiritual of course, I don't care to much for physical combat although I do see the value in it (protecting ourselves and loved ones). While reading on the Tribulation, and dimly grasping the fact that it will be a an unparalleled and grim time, oddly enough I want to be in it and go through it. Mainly because I want to see Jesus in His 2nd advent and show my faith (although I know much spiritual preparation is needed). I am wondering is this the wrong attitude to have? Luke 21:26-28 is scripture I want to experience. What is the proper biblical perspective a believer should have on these matters as far as wanting to undergo this dark time.

Also to transition into rewards, will our opportunity to gain rewards be increased during this time? Another question on rewards in general, I came across a leader of a church whose attitude toward wanting to receive rewards from the Lord almost nonexistent. The attitude is almost like "all I am worried about is making it into eternity because we all will be with God". If this is true (which it is) then what is the point of receiving rewards when all believers will experience the greatest gift of all (full access to God) in eternity? Or is it for the Millennium? What is our catalyst here? I know you have tons of emails and at the same time I encourage you for a detailed response, I don't mind reading and this will help with me understanding this manner.

Thanks in advance and I look forward to hearing from you.

I hope all is well with you sir.

God bless

Response #10:

Good to hear from you again. As to your questions:

1) Reward motivation is absolutely essential both to encourage us in our spiritual advance, but also to help us through difficult times:

"For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also."
Matthew 6:21 NIV

And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly seek him.
Hebrews 11:6 NIV

Yes, "just being there" will be wonderful beyond our present understanding, and even the last in line to receive the absolute minimal reward will be part of the Bride forever with an inheritance in the New Jerusalem. However, it is glorifying to our Lord to earn rewards; it's better to be Abraham than the last one in line. Consider the parable of the talents; clearly, Jesus wants us to earn more not less. Consider the parable of the Sower; clearly, Jesus wants us to produce more not less. And if we are shooting for more we are likely to earn more not less, whereas if we see reward as unimportant we are more likely to fall into the trap of being more like the one who earned nothing with his talent or the ground whose production is stunted by weeds. Paul speaks of "gold, silver and precious stones"; clearly, having earned these is better than producing nothing but "wood, hay and stubble" (1Cor.3). Just because many Christians are lazy or cowardly or too concerned with worldly things is no reason to make a false virtue out of laziness or cowardice or worldliness – far less is it reason to make those who are not thinking in such counterproductive ways feel guilty about embracing what the Lord and His Word of truth tells us to aspire to:

To the one who is victorious and does my will to the end, I will give authority over the nations—that one ‘will rule them with an iron scepter and will dash them to pieces like pottery’—just as I have received authority from my Father.
Revelation 2:26-27 NIV

2) There have always been opportunities to "win the three crowns" (see the link which includes information about reward motivation), and that will be true during the Tribulation as well. I am not sure that the opportunities will be so much greater as they will be different and also accelerated – and that cuts both ways. Fully one third of the Church will apostatize and lose salvation as well as reward; but another third will be martyred, and this guarantees a certain level of reward (for legitimate martyrs, that is).

If being excited about the nearness of these events and the prospect of actually seeing with one's own eyes these things which scripture has been prophesying for millennia helps to make preparation a priority, then I would say it is a good thing indeed. After all, the more real these things become to us in our hearts, the more likely we are to do due diligence in spiritual preparation to get ready for what is coming (whereas to the extent that they are just words we will have a tendency to go on about our business as if they won't possibly happen in our day).

In addition to becoming genuinely prepared, the other real challenge will be to maintain that level of enthusiasm when the darkness sets in – for beyond all argument it is prophesied to be a terrible time. But for those of us who are looking beyond the darkness to the Light which about to dawn once and for all, enthusiasm for our Lord's return – and our resurrection when He comes – is never out of place:

"Now when these things begin to happen, look up and lift up your heads, because your redemption draws near."
Luke 21:28 NKJV

Yours in our dear Lord and Savior Jesus Christ for whose return we eagerly wait,

Bob L.

Question #11:

Hello Dr. Luginbill, I pray all is well!

What is the main purpose of the Millennium rule of Christ? Is this a sort of second and chance (confirming choice) for none believers?

Thanks as always

Response #11:

Hello Friend,

Good to hear from you as always. Interesting question.

As I have opined in the past, the Millennium, being the time of the most perfect environment the world outside of the garden of Eden has ever seen – with even the Genesis chapter three curse having been removed from the ground – will indeed be a test of the hearts of mankind. For the "prosperity test" is often the most difficult one to pass. More than that, the fact that at the end of a thousand years of peace and plenty the likes of which the world has never imagined under the perfect rule of Christ the world will nevertheless seek to overthrow the Messiah at the first opportunity (the Gog-Magog rebellion following Satan's release) proves beyond any shadow of a doubt that people do not go to hell because of bad breaks or a poor environment or out of ignorance: they go to hell because they are in their heart of hearts unwilling to share heaven with the Lord (see the links:  "the Gog-Magog Rebellion" and "The Problem of Unbelievers").

(1) Why are the nations forming into a mob and the peoples [of the earth] grumbling idly. (2) The kings of the earth are assembling and its princes are gathering together – against the Lord and His Anointed One, [saying] (3) "Let us pull off Their chains, and cast Their cords from us!"
Psalm 2:1-3

And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, and shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea. And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
Revelation 20:7-9 NIV

Yours in our dear Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, 

Bob L.

Question #12:

Just off the press on blood-moons:

http://www.emethbiblestudies.org/Guestbook.php

Love to hear your feedback

Response #12:

Nice work! I certainly would agree that repetitive celestial phenomena like "blood moons" (which are figuring heavily in internet discussions of the impending end times these days) are by definition not prophetic, and that what we have predicted in scripture for the end times are indeed supernatural occurrences that are quite clearly from God. Moreover, there are no prophesied events for the Church Age – all remaining prophecy only begins with the commencement of the Tribulation.

On blood moons:

Blood moons

More on Blood moons

On the rapture, please see:

When is the Rapture?

Your pal in our dear Lord and Savior Jesus Christ,

Bob L.

Question #13:

Hi Bob,

Before the judgment of rewards, are we expected to argue our case before the Lord regarding events of this life, or will the judgment be done not as a "trial case"?

Response #13:

Thanks as always for your help on the typos.

My understanding of the judgments, for believers and unbelievers alike, is that there is not going to be any "arguing" when we stand before the Lord. Instead, the Lord will demonstrate to believers and for believers the pluses of every believer's life and the basis/reasons for reward (as well as the basis/reasons for discounting everything that does not count for reward). The sins of unbelievers likewise have been paid for at the cross, so their judgment will likewise be one of evaluating their "works"; however in their case it will be made clear to all, believers and unbelievers alike, how in the case of each and every one of those who did not believe God's truth was willfully rejected, and how that nothing anyone did was "good enough" to merit consideration by the Lord – so that the judgment of condemnation is absolutely fair in every single case. The links on this:

The judgment of the Church

The last judgment of unbelievers

Yours in our dear Lord and Savior Jesus Christ

Question #14:

Good evening Dr.,

I hope this email finds you and your family in good sprits. I continue to pray for your ministry when the thought arises.

I have a couple of questions that I want to run by you and feel it is better to send in one email. It seems I write down my questions and then give it to you at one time so as to not bombard you.

1. In reading Amos 3:7, " Surely the Lord God will do nothing without revealing His secret to His servants the prophets". Does this passage also relates to unveiling of events around tribulation including its starting date as you proposed around 2026? And who does God mean by "prophets"? Are they teachers, like yourselves, any Spirit-filled individuals? Just wanted clarification.

2. SR#3 as it relates to the judgement of Adam, Eve and serpent. Is there a significance in the order God ministered the judgement? Was the serpent giving the first judgement because he was the main instigator? To me the flow of verses Genesis 3:8-9 is fascinating. God addressed Adam because the initial commandment for abstention was to him. He blamed Eve. Then God addressed Eve and she told Him the serpent deceived her. God did not address the serpent but immediately pronounced judgement on him. Then he pronounced it on Eve and finally on Adam. Is there a significance in the order?

3. My next study from your site will be the Peter Series after SR but I have a question related to spiritual growth and testing. Is it scriptural to ask God for test to grow you spiritually. I know you should be careful what you pray for but is there a biblical support to ask for spiritual tests to grow you? If not, how can one know for sure the Lord is pleased with his current path? I guess that is the question I am really asking?

Thank you for all you do for us laymen in God's word and may He continue to bless you richly in Christ our Lord.

Response #14:

Good to hear from you too, my friend, and thanks so very much for your prayers.

As to your questions:

1) I am certainly no prophet. In my view of what scripture teaches on this matter, there haven't been any true prophets – individuals with a gift of prophecy given by the Lord – since the last apostle, John, passed from the scene ca. 70 A.D. Prophecy is both a gift (widely distributed in the early days of the Church to fill the gap in teaching the truth before the canon was written and distributed) and an office (as it was in ancient Israel), whereby God communicates His truth directly to the person in question (but now we have the complete Bible). The Bible was written under agency of prophecy with the Holy Spirit inspiring the exact words of the Bible to those chosen to pen it:

No single verse of prophetically inspired scripture has ever come into being as a result of personal reflection. For true prophecy has never occurred by human will, but only when holy men of God have spoken under the direction and agency of the Holy Spirit.
2nd Peter 1:20b-21

As to 2026, that is an interpretation based upon biblical information. I do believe that it is a correct interpretation, but I always provide readers with the basis upon which the interpretation has been built (repeated here as often):

The most potentially controversial piece of information developed below, that is, the projected date for the commencement of the Tribulation, is based upon the following suppositions (all of which are treated within the context of this study):

The above points are all presented here as true, and the analysis upon which they are based is set forth below. Clearly, deviation from any of the above will alter the entire scheme. It is also true, as we have already said, that alteration of the schema presented below is certainly within the power and authority of the Almighty. The very end of the Tribulation, for example, will be shortened by some undisclosed amount of time (Mk.13:20). Rather than undermining the theory advanced in this study, however, Mark 13:20 in actuality supports the importance of paying heed to the Bible's chronological information. For if "the days are shortened", then surely this means that there was a definite heavenly timetable in the first place. Secondly, Mark 13:20 indicates that the shortening mentioned is a matter of days, weeks at the most (i.e., not enough to change the general time-line given below). This is certainly in line with the very specific tally of days and months given in Daniel and Revelation (Dan.7:25; 8:14; 12:7; 12:11-12; Rev.11:2-3; 12:6; 12:14; 13:5).

2) It's an interesting observation. Adam sinned in cognizance, Eve in ignorance, and the serpent under instigation/control of the devil. That always seems to be the order of God's judgment, and it says something about His mercy. Believers are evaluated first after resurrection, with the most successful first and the least successful last; unbelievers and their last judgment comes last of all. If you have not already done so, there is more information about this judgment at the links:

False Doctrines Peter #27

The Fall (in SR 3)

Adam and Eve

3) On this one, I don't know of any scriptural parallel, and there are plenty of prayers in the Bible. Most Christians I now have far too many burdens and challenges to think about asking for more, and it's not the normal human thing to do, needless to say. I can't tell you "no", but here is one scripture to consider:

LORD, my heart is not haughty,
Nor my eyes lofty.
Neither do I concern myself with great matters,
Nor with things too profound for me.
Surely I have calmed and quieted my soul,
Like a weaned child with his mother;
Like a weaned child is my soul within me.
Psalm 131:1b-2

Yours in our dear Lord and Savior Jesus Christ,

Bob L.

Question #15:

Why is Babylon deemed worthy of having the land be uninhabited during the Millennium but Revived Rome isn't? I understand that Babylon is the origin of Antichrist, but Revived Rome is the country that does the actual evil. So if one land were to be cursed to be desolated during the Millennium, wouldn't it be more logical to presume it would be Europe (Revived Rome)?

Sincerely,

Response #15:

It is what it is. If we want to explain it, I would say that the parallel between mystery Babylon and revived Rome is like that of a queen and her handmaiden, with the former far more culpable than the latter in fact, even if the activities of the latter are more obvious. Even though revived Rome figures large in all of the events of the Tribulation, here is what scripture says about Babylon's role in the persecution of the Church:

The name written on her forehead was a mystery: Babylon the great the mother of prostitutes and of the abominations of the earth. I saw that the woman was drunk with the blood of God’s holy people, the blood of those who bore testimony to Jesus.
Rev 17:5-6a NIV

It may seem odd to us that to Babylon is attributed the destruction of the saints, since this is something the beast and his false religion accomplish from his new headquarters in Jerusalem, but Babylon's culpability is emphasized no doubt because she is the beginning and prime source of antichrist's strength, as well as the source of the abominable thinking and acting that characterizes the Tribulation (v.5 above).

Yours in our dear Lord and Savior Jesus Christ,

Bob L.

Question #16:

I was an artillery ammunition specialist in the National Guards for some years. Our jobs was to project ammo to a location for Bradley's to come and pick up to fire at a certain target. Not friendly targets but enemy targets. The final battle is to pursue outward and not inward because friendly forces are necessarily inward to protect. Why would God have a final battle in HIS HOLY CITY CALLED JERUSALEM TO DESTROY HIS OWN PEOPLE. ZION AS WE CALL IT? THAT BATTLE WILL BE FOUGHT IN THE VALLEY AND JERUSALEM IS THE HOLY CITY. NO, WE KNOW WHERE MEGEDDON IS! WE AS ARTILLERY DIDN'T DESTROY OUR OWN--WE FOUGHT OUTWARDLY ICHTHYS AND I KNOW GOD WILL NOT DESTROY JERUSALEM TO SAY THAT IS WHERE ARMEGEDDON WILL TAKE PLACE--WE DON'T SERVE A SUICIDAL ORGANISM!

Response #16:

In that case, how do you interpret this passage of holy scripture?

(2) For I shall gather all the nations to Jerusalem to fight against her. The city will be captured, its houses will be sacked, and its women will be ravished. (3) Half of the city will be taken away captive, but the rest of the people will not be cut off from the city. Then the Lord will go forth, and He will fight against those nations as when He fights on a day of battle. (4) For His feet will stand on that day on the Mount of Olives which lies before Jerusalem on the east.
Zechariah 14:2-4a

Question #17:

THE FINAL BATTLE-There's a difference between destruction and destroyed! THE FINAL BATTLE AND JERUSALEM WILL BE SAFELY INHABITED..That's in Zechariah 14:11.

Response #17:

I certainly never suggested that Jerusalem would be completely destroyed.

Your first email found fault with Armageddon taking place at Jerusalem and its environs based upon what seemed from your message to be the assumption that no harm whatsoever will come to the city. Zechariah chapter fourteen certainly demonstrates that such is not the case.

As to Zechariah 14:11, this part of the chapter, beginning in verse eight, is speaking about the situation after our Lord's return – as it says in verse nine, for example, "And the LORD shall be King over all the earth" – that is, after His return.

Not understanding your question or your objection on this end.

Question #18:

Hello Dr. Luginbill,

I heard a sermon where the pastor said that the antichrist will be handsome, and that will draw people to him. The pastor was using the book of Daniel to support this, but I feel he was taking it out of context. There is a passage in Daniel that says that the beast is a king of "fierce countenance". What does that mean? Does it mean he has a stern appearance, and where did the pastor get that he is handsome. I also feel that the antichrist is half angelic and half human. What is your take on this?

God Bless you and your ministry,

Response #18:

The "fierce countenance" passage (Dan.8:23) does refer to antichrist, but it doesn't mean "handsome" (I translate it "stern-faced").

I would not be surprised if the beast is considered "handsome" by some or even many. It seems clear that he will be a person of exceptional charisma; that is necessary in order to gain control of mystery Babylon swiftly and by non-traditional means. Scripture doesn't give us all the details but what may be gleaned about antichrist's personal characteristics and his methods for political success may found at the following links.

The charisma of antichrist (in CT 3B)

The rise of antichrist (in CT 3B)

Yours in Jesus Christ our dear Lord and Savior,

Bob L.

Question #19:

What do you think about this Ebola situation?  Any application for the end times?

Response #19:

Retirement in Liberia is now off the table.  Seriously, I suppose it is another "sign of the times", that is, part of the cocktail of negative trends which ought to make Christians sit up, take notice, and begin to prepare.

Question #20:

Do you think our handling of the Ebola situation is a way for the US to institute martial law?

Response #20:

I try to stay away from all things political. In very short order, antichrist will be in charge, and all manner of terrible things will come to pass, irrespective of puny political efforts on our part (which for Christians are therefore a monumental waste of time); those dark days will only be possible for Christians to negotiate through a very close walk with Jesus Christ – one that has been developed now while the sun still shines, so to speak. So all of these frightening things happening in the world today ought, in my opinion, be motivation for all Christians to double down on their efforts of spiritual growth, progress and service, "and all the more as you see the Day drawing near" (Heb.10:25 ESV). Here are some links:

Preparing for Tribulation (CT 7)

The Tribulation: Timing of, Preparation for, and Conditions in

In Jesus our dear Lord,

Bob L.

Question #21:

I read the one of the books that you mentioned in one of your email responses and I have to say it definitely tries to explain the origin of the pre-tribulation rapture. In doing some very in-depth research some think it was started by a man named John Darby and some thought that it was started by a Scottish girl named Margaret MacDonald. Darby claimed that the revelation of the rapture came to him when he realized the distinction between Israel and the church. Now here's the thing, I have even seen books written and published in the late 1700s which convey pre-tribulation teachings and Morgan Edwards also supposedly taught pre-tribulationism in the 1700s.

Response #21:

Good to hear from you. I am no expert in the intricacies of Church History. They say that history is written by the victors; what I know about Church History generally is that beyond very broad stroke patterns we really cannot know what was happening in the true Church apart from what we have in scripture (and that is restricted to the period of Acts and to the general trends of the seven Church eras covered in chapters two and three of the Book of Revelation). This is because that would require knowing what was really going on in the hearts of individual believers. The "real" history of the Church will not be revealed to us until we all stand before Christ's judgment seat and He gives us the truth about how each of us performed.

As to pre-trib history, I am not aware of anything before Darby. I would be a bit surprised to see any definitive teaching of a pre-tribulation rapture as early as you say (at least anything which definitively and unreseveredly teaches verbatim just that), only because the Roman Catholic church essentially eschewed eschatology and during its long tenure threw the church-visible off the track of the truth into an eschatological funk by preaching amillenialism.

This same essential paradigm for interpreting (really, for ignoring) what the Bible has to say about the end times was perpetuated by the Reformers (and therefore all Reform denominations) not, I think, out of a disregard for scripture or the truth, but because eschatology was one of the last things to be revisited and reformed and so to shake off medieval assumptions. Since almost everyone in Christendom was amillennial before the nineteenth century, finding definite pre-trib teaching earlier would surprise me (there is evidence in the church fathers of post-trib teaching before the rise of Rome, however).

To that end, and specific quotation with references you might be able to provide would be interesting to see.

Yours in the One who is the truth itself, our dear Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

Bob L.

Question #22:

Professor, are we to flee to Bozrah? I know the Bible mentions this place six times and according to the book of Micah this is suppose to be a hiding place for us. The "flight ( - manos: flight, place of escape or refuge) to Bozrah " according to the scriptures point to a place where the elect, God's covenant people, are in exile. It is the time of "Jacob's trouble".

In Revelation 12:6 and 12:14 we see quite clearly that this end-time exile will be going on during the last 3.5 years or 1260 days of this age. So the Micah 2:12-13 passage concerning the gathering of Jacob, (God's covenant people before they are refined to become Israel, - Prince with God), cross references with John's account of the flight and exile of the woman in Revelation 12. John saw the woman in travail being delivered of the man-child. This is precisely what we would expect in the end-time drama. This is clearly an apocalyptic event since the 1260 day/3.5 year time period coincides exactly with the Great Tribulation. Jesus tells us that this Great Tribulation will come after the midweek abomination of desolation, which is half way through the final seven years of this age.

Response #22:

Micah in Micah 2:12-13 refers to the "sheepfold of Bozrah". But only the KJV and Young's Literal Translation have allowed this information to pass through to us. Unfortunately this reference to the "Bozrah sheepfold" is not to be found in the modern translations. It seems to have been "lost in translation".

It is true that Revelation chapter twelve details the flight of believing Jews from Israel at the commencement of the Great Tribulation; they do flee into the desert east of Israel (in the direction of Bozrah). Gentile Christians alive at that time, however, will apparently not be included. The Church consists of gentiles and Jews. However, the Tribulation will be a joint period belonging to both Israel and the Church, so that there will be some differences in the modus operandi the Lord indicates for the two groups (the 144,000, for example, will go not to the gentiles but to the "lost sheep of Israel"). Gentiles will have an escape as well, those who live in Babylon at least will; but that will not occur until very near the end of the Tribulation proper, being angelically announced. Finally, as to Micah 2:12-13, I see this as a millennial passage. Our Lord says in verse twelve: "I will surely assemble, O Jacob, all of thee; I will surely gather the remnant of Israel" (KJV). This assembly of all Israel who survive the Tribulation here, regathering them to the land of Israel, is a matter of prophetic significance throughout the Old Testament. Here are a collection of links which deal with these subjects:

The Dragon's Persecution of Believing Israel:  Revelation 12:13-17

Flee Babylon

The Regathering and Purging of Israel

A Tribulational Code of Conduct

The last link above in particular is important in regard to the question "what is a Christian to do?" when the Tribulation begins. For the most part, gentile Christians are to "remain at their posts" until such time as we are directed to flee Babylon by God Himself.

Yours in our dear Lord and Savior Jesus Christ,

Bob L.

Question #23:

America may be Babylon The Great:

Consider this: The former prophets all warned of this coming Great Babylon. Let's look at what each one said about it:

Isaiah said:

1. Babylon would be noted for its architecture, buildings and skyline (Isaiah 13:22)

2. Is the lone super power of the world (Isaiah 47:5,8)

3. Is the most respected and envied around the world and yet at the same time is hated by the world. (Isaiah 18:2)

4. Has a unique and remarkable beginning, different from other nations and has been awe-inspirition. (Isaiah 18:2).

5. Babylon would the QUEEN AMONG THE NATIONS (Isa 47:5,7)

6. Babylon would be an END TIME GREAT NATION (Rev 17,18; Isa 13:6)

7. Babylon is called a lady, and has the symbol of the Lady (Isa 47:7-9). "LIBERTY" on our money, and sits in the New York Harbor.

8. Babylon is nation "peeled", or timbered, a land of open fields (Isa 18:2).

9. Babylon is land quartered by mighty rivers (Isa 18:2).

10. Babylon is a land that is measured out, and populated throughout (Isa 18:2).

11. Babylon destroys her own land, with pollution and waste (Isa 14:20, 18:2, 7).

12. Babylon is the leading INDUSTRIAL NATION OF THE WORLD

13. Babylon has a huge aviation program (Isa 14:13-14;

14. Babylon is a REPUBLIC or a DEMOCRACY, it is ruled by many counsels (Isa 47:13).

15. Babylon's governmental system breaks down (Isa 47:13).

16. Babylon is bogged down with deliberations and cannot govern properly (Isa 47:13).

17. Babylon's leaders use astrology, seers and mystics for guidance (Isa 47:13; Rev 18:2).

18. Babylon labored in the occult from her very inception (Isa 47:12).

19. Babylon is a nation of religious confusion (Isa 47:12-13).

20. THE KING OF BABYLON is called LUCIFER, the ANTICHRIST (Isa 14:4-6).

21. The King of Babylon will rule from THE GREAT CITY BABYLON (Isa 14:4-6; Rev 17: 18).

22. A world government entity will rise up to rule the world from BABYLON THE CITY

23. This entity will rise up and use the military power of Babylon the nation to RULE THE WORLD (Isa 14:4-6;

24.Babylon is a nation of higher education and learning (Isa47:10, implied throughout).

25. Babylon is a VIRGIN NATION, her lands untouched by major war (Isa 47:1).9. Babylon's enemy will lie on the opposite side of the world,over the poles (Isa 13:5)

26. The enemy of Babylon will be noted for her cruelty (Isa 13,14, Jer 50, 51, Rev 17, 18).

27. The people of Babylon would think they are God's elect and eternal (Isa 47:7-8,

28. The nation Babylon dwells carelessly before the Lord (Isa 47:8).

29. Babylon becomes proud, haughty, and does not consider her end (Isa 47:7-8).

30. Babylon deals in the occult, in sorceries and drugs (Isa 47:9, 12; Rev 18:23)

31. The people of Babylon are deep into astrology and spiritism (Isa 47:12; Rev 18:2).

32. Babylon's enemy will lie on the opposite side of the world, over the poles (Isa 13:5)

Jeremiah prophesied:

1. Babylon would be the center of a one world Luciferian religious movement (Jer 51:44)

2. Babylon would be the youngest and greatest of the end time nations (Jer 50:12). USA

3. Babylon would be the most powerful nation in the world (Isa 47, Jer 50, 51, Rev 18). USA

4. Babylon would be the HAMMER OF THE WHOLE EARTH (Jer 50:23; Rev 18:23). USA

5. Babylon would be the praise of the WHOLE EARTH (Jer 51:41). USA

6. Babylon is a land rich in mineral wealth (Jer 51:13).

7. Babylon is a the leading agricultural nation of the world (Jer 50, 51; Rev 18).

8. Babylon is the leading exporting nation in the world (Jer 51:13; Rev 18).

9. Babylon is the leading importing nation of the entire world.(Jer 50, 51; Rev 18).

10. Babylon is a nation filled with warehouses and granaries (Jer 50:26).

11. Babylon is the leading INDUSTRIAL NATION OF THE WORLD (Isa 13, 47, Jer 50, 51; Rev 18).

12. Babylon is noted for her horses (Jer 50:37). Think Kentucky

13. Babylon is noted for her cattle, sheep and other livestock (Jer 50:26, 27; Rev 18:13).

14. Babylon is noted for her fine flour and mill operations (Rev 18:13)

15. Babylon is a nation of farmers and harvests huge crops (Jer 50:16, 26, 27).28. Babylon has a huge aviation program (Isa 14:13-14; Jer 51:53; Hab 1:6-10).

16. Babylon's skies are filled with the whisper of aircraft wings (Isa 18:1; Jer 51:53).

17. Babylon has a huge space industry, has "mounted up to the heavens" (Jer 51:53).

18. Babylon fortifies her skies with a huge military aviation program (Jer 51:53).

19. Babylon is portrayed as a leading in high tech weapons and abilities (Jer 51:53; Hab 1:6-10; implied throughout).

20. Babylon is a coastal nation and sits upon MANY WATERS (Jer 51:13).

21. Babylon is nation filled with a "mingled" people (Jer 50:37).

22. Babylon is a SINGULAR NATION founded upon OUT OF MANY, ONE (Isa 13, 47, Jer 50, 51, Hab 1).

23. Babylon was born as a CHRISTIAN NATION (Jer 50:12).

24. Babylon turns upon its heritage and destroys it all in the end (Jer 50:11).

25. Babylon's Christian leaders lead their flock astray in prophecy and salvation (Jer 50:6; implied Rev 18:2).

26. Babylon's Christian leaders are "strangers" in the Lord Houses of Worship (Jer 51:51).

27. Babylon sets of detention centers for Jews and Christians and rounds them up for extermination (Jer 50:7, 33; 51:35, 49; Rev 17:6; 18:24).

28. Babylon has a mother nation that remains in existence from her birth to death (Jer 50: 12). (ENGLAND)

29. The mother of Babylon has the symbol of the LION (Dan7:4; Eze 38:13; Jer 51:38; Psalms 17:12).

30. The mother of Babylon will rule over her daughter her entire life (Dan 7:4; Jer 50:12). Follow the money, we are under total control of England's Banks, and have been since 1914

31. The mother of Babylon will be a state of major decline as the end nears (Jer 50:12).

32. Babylon is considered to be a lion's whelp (Eze 38:13; Jer 51:38).58.

33. Babylon will have the symbol of the EAGLE and builds her nest in the stars (Dan 7:4 EAGLE WINGS; Isa 14:13-14; Jer 51:53). Who else has a space program as we do?

34. Babylon is a huge producer and exporter of automobiles (Jer 50:37; Rev 18:13).

35. Babylon is a nation of CRAFTSMEN, experts in their trade (Jer 50, 51, Rev 18:22).

36. Babylon is a nation with a GREAT VOICE in world affairs (Jer 51:55)

37 .Babylon will be instrumental in the setting up of Israel in the Middle East, and is the home of God's people (Jer 50:47;51:45).

38. Babylon will have a major enemy to her north (Jer 50:3, 9, 41).

39. The enemy of Babylon will also have a huge aviation military machine (Jer 50:9, 14, Rev 18:8, 18 implied throughout).

40. Babylon will have all of her borders cut off, and there will be no way of escape (Jer 50:28; 51:32).

41. Babylon is land vast land with huge cities, towns and villages throughout (Implied throughout).

42. Babylon will have been a huge missionary nation for Jesus Christ (Jer 50:11; 51:7).

43. Babylon would be a home to multitudes of Jews who leave (Jer 50:4-6, 8; 51:6, 45)

44. The people of Babylon would not know their true identity(Jer 50:6, implied throughout).

45. The people of Babylon would grow mad upon their idols (Jer 50:2, 38; Hab 2:18).

46. How is the hammer of the whole earth cut asunder and broken! how is Babylon become a desolation among the nations! -Jeremiah 50:23

47. O thou that dwellest upon many waters, abundant in treasures, thine end is come, and the measure of thy covetousness. The LORD of hosts hath sworn by himself, saying, Surely I will fill thee with men, as with caterpillars; and they shall lift up a shout against thee. -Jeremiah 51:12-14

48. Plays a leadership role in Outer Space Exploration (Jer. 51:3)

49. Is where the world's leaders meet and assemble (Jer. 51:44)

50. Incorporated many aspects of the old Babylonian religion (Jer. 50:2).

The Apostle John said in the Book of Revelation:

1. Babylon deals in the occult, in sorceries and drugs (Isa 47:9, 12; Rev 18:23)

2. The people of Babylon would go into deep sins of all kinds (Rev 18:5).

3. The people of Babylon would think they are God's elect and eternal (Isa 47:7-8, Rev 18:7).

4. The people of Babylon would enjoy the highest standard of living in the world (Rev 18:7).

5. Babylon will be destroyed by nuclear fire (Implied throughout)

6. Babylon is land vast land with huge cities, towns and villages throughout (Implied throughout).

7. The enemy of Babylon will be noted for her cruelty (Isa 13,14, Jer 50, 51, Rev 17, 18).

8. The enemy of Babylon will also have a huge aviation military machine (Jer 50:9, 14, Rev 18:8, 18 implied throughout).

9. Babylon has a vast military machine (Jer 50:36; 51:30; Hab 1 & 2, Rev 13:4).

10. This entity will rise up and use the military power of Babylon the nation to RULE THE WORLD (Isa 14:4-6; Hab 1 & 2, Rev 13, 17).

11. Babylon is a huge producer and exporter of automobiles (Jer 50:37; Rev 18:13).

12. Babylon is a nation of CRAFTSMEN, experts in their trade (Jer 50, 51, Rev 18:22).

13. Babylon is noted for her jewelry of gold and silver (Rev 18:22).

14. Babylon is a huge importer and exporter of spices (Rev 18:13).

15. Babylon is a huge exporter of fine marble products (Rev 18:22).

16. Babylon is noted for her iron and steel production (Rev 18:12).

17. Babylon has huge corporations that have bases around the world (Rev 18:23, implied throughout)

18. A world government entity will rise up to rule the world from BABYLON THE CITY (Isa 14; Hab 2, Rev 13, 17, 18).

19. Babylon turns totally antichrist and is the leading antichrist power at the end (Rev 18:2; Isa 14:4-6).

20. The King of Babylon will rule from THE GREAT CITY BABYLON (Isa 14:4-6; Rev 17: 18).

21. Babylon turns upon its own people and imprisons and slays them by millions (Jer 50:7,33; 51:35; 39; Dan 7:25; Rev 13:7;17:6; 18:24).

22. Babylon sets of detention centers for Jews and Christians and rounds them up for extermination (Jer 50:7, 33; 51:35, 49; Rev 17:6; 18:24).

23. The people of Babylon are deep into astrology and spiritism (Isa 47:12; Rev 18:2).

24. Babylon becomes the home of all antichrist religions in the world (Rev 18:2).

25. Babylon's Christian leaders lead their flock astray in prophecy and salvation (Jer 50:6; implied Rev 18:2).

26. Babylon falls to the occult just before her end by nuclear fire (Rev 18:2)

27. Babylon's leaders use astrology, seers and mystics for guidance (Isa 47:13; Rev 18:2).

28. Babylon trades with all who have ships in the sea year round(Rev 18:17-18).

29. Babylon is a nation filled with warm water seaports (Rev 18:17-19).

30. Babylon is a huge exporter of MUSIC (Rev 18:22).

31. Babylon's musicians are known around the world (Rev 18:22)

32. Babylon is noted for her cattle, sheep and other livestock (Jer 50:26, 27; Rev 18:13).

33. Babylon is noted for her fine flour and mill operations (Rev 18:13)

34. Babylon is the leading INDUSTRIAL NATION OF THE WORLD (Isa 13, 47, Jer 50, 51; Rev 18).

35. Babylon is a the leading agricultural nation of the world (Jer 50, 51; Rev 18).

36. Babylon is the leading exporting nation in the world (Jer 51:13; Rev 18).

37. Babylon is the leading importing nation of the entire world.(Jer 50, 51; Rev 18).

38. Babylon is center of world trade (Jer 51:44; Rev 17:18; 18:19).USA

39. Babylon would grow to be the richest nation in the world (Rev 18:3, 7, 19, 23). USA

40. All nations that traded with Babylon would grow rich (Rev 18:3). USA

41. The merchants of Babylon were the GREAT MEN OF THE EARTH (Rev 18:23). USA, all one need to do is look at the huge multi-national corporations that exist. American companies (merchants) the greatest on Earth.

42. Babylon would the QUEEN AMONG THE NATIONS (Isa 47:5,7; Rev 18:7). USA

43. Babylon would be the most powerful nation in the world (Isa 47, Jer 50, 51, Rev 18). USA

44. Babylon would be the HAMMER OF THE WHOLE EARTH (Jer 50:23; Rev 18:23). USA

45. Babylon would be the center for the move to a global economic order (Rev 13:16).

46. The Great City Babylon would be the economic nerve center of the world (Rev 18:3). New York is the Financial Capital of the World.

47. Babylon would be an END TIME GREAT NATION (Rev 17,18; Isa 13:6).

48. Babylon would have a huge seaport city within its borders (Rev 18:17). New York harbor is the biggest in the World.

49. The Great City Babylon is the home of a world government attempt (Rev 17:18). This can only be NEW YORK, where the United Nations sits.

50. Is considered intoxicating for it's high society lifestyle (Rev. 17:2, 18:3,23)

51. Is noted for its elegant and extravagant lifestyle (Rev. 18:14).

52. Is noted for being a city/nation of immigrants from all over the world (Rev. 18:15).

53. Is noted for a massive population (Rev. 18:15).

54. Is noted for its importation of drugs (Rev. 18:23).

55. Is the leading center of Commerce (Rev. 17:2)

56. Is the leading center of imports and consumption (Rev. 18:11)

57. Is a leading center of manufacturing (Rev. 18:22)

58. Is the center for world trade in gold, silver, copper, oil, precious gems, cloth, clothing, fashions, lumber, containers, household items, furniture, wine, livestock, transportation, health products, cosmetics, spices, marble, irony, and iron. (Rev. 18:11-13)

Response #23:

I think the conclusion is correct (although I'm not vouching for the lists). Here are some links at Ichthys:

Probable identification of mystery Babylon (in CT 3B)

Historic vs. mystery Babylon

Babylon USA?

Yours in our dear Lord and Savior Jesus Christ,

Bob L.

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