Question #1:
One last question while we're here if you don't mind.
So I've been talking to a believer at work (shared Ichthys and my
website with him) and he asked me about the eternal security question
and I answered accordingly as we both believe. We both know that the
Bible teaches that we do need to maintain our faith to the very end if
we want it to remain. However, people have a big problem with that
because they may think that saying we have to maintain our salvation
(maintaining our faith) is the same as working our way to heaven through
self effort. I've thought about how I would respond if this concern was
brought up but I'm not sure how I would explain it.
So, how would you explain to someone that maintaining our faith through
free will choice to grow spiritually is not the same as working our way
to heaven since it would appear free will does take effort of a certain
type? I'm just not sure how I would respond to this without giving
people the wrong impression. Obviously, we can't work our way to heaven
but how do we differentiate self-effort from "faith maintenance?" I
think you get what I'm asking. I've thought about this for a long time
but never addressed i head on.
In Christ,
Response #1:
As I've probably mentioned to you more than once, my specialty / gifting has to
do with teaching the Word . . . to believers who are interested. Apologetics is
not my forte.
However, since you ask, my initial reaction would be to explain how that
believers are saved but unbelievers are not saved.
"The one who believes in Him is not being judged, but the one who does not believe has already been judged on the grounds that he has not put his faith in the Name (i.e., the Person) of God's only Son."
John 3:18
"The one who believes" (present participle = is believing NOW) is saved; "the
one who does not believe" (present participle = is not believing NOW) is NOT
saved. So if a person is "not believing" in Jesus Christ, that person is, by
definition, NOT a believer and, according to our Lord's words above, not saved.
The following part of the verse, "he has not put his faith" is my translation of
the perfect tense of pisteuo, which may also be translated a bit more
literally "is not in a state of faith" (perfects represent present state based
on past action just as in English: e.g., "I have come to know" = I learned in
the past so that I know now). Believers are often referred to in scripture with
the participle as above, meaning "those who believe" or "believing persons",
indicating NOT that they once upon a time believed but that they are NOW
(whenever now is) still believing (e.g., Acts 4:12; 22:19; 1Thes.1:7). So
scripture is very clear; it's only theology (especially Reformed theology) which
is confusing . . . because it is internally and logically derived rather than
being directly based on scripture).
Here's a link which will lead to others:
Eternal Security and Perseverance
This is an important issue at the present time in particular because of our
nearness to the Tribulation. Imagining that "At least I'm saved whatever I do"
will no doubt embolden some to compromise and take the mark of the beast. But
scripture tells us clearly that there can be no compromise on that point, e.g.:
Then a third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, “If anyone worships the beast and his image, and receives his mark on his forehead or on his hand, he himself shall also drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out full strength into the cup of His indignation. He shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment ascends forever and ever; and they have no rest day or night, who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name.”
Revelation 14:9-11 NKJV
So in addition to the false notions that we will be "raptured" off the planet
before the Tribulation begins (when in fact that will not happen), or that if we
are "church members in good standing" we will have nothing to worry about (when
in fact all churches will be subsumed in antchrist's religion), "unconditional
eternal security regardless of faith" will be an extremely dangerous false
doctrine to believe in once those last seven years begin.
See the link: Peter #27: Three false doctrines that threaten
faith
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #2:
You know what, you're right. I suppose I am getting into theology again
(happened in one of our last discussions too). It also just so happens
that this young man I've been talking with has the gift of apologetics
and loves to go around challenging a lot of the unbelievers at work. Not
a bad thing so I would never want to stop him (I even encouraged him by
telling him it was a good thing) although I think sometimes he takes it
too far by pushing people that have made it clear they aren't
interested. To me, once a person has clarified that they don't want it,
it isn't good to keep pestering them about it, regardless of one's
spiritual gift.
This man does occasionally ask me questions, though, since he knows I'm
a teacher (he has seen my site and yours). Like yourself, I don't have
the gift of apologetics either and would rather not debate topics but
try to answer questions instead, hence I asked you this. However, as a
Bible teacher, I sense you're right that I don't need to worry about
engaging this too much and getting caught up in theology. He wasn't
satisfied with my original answers (before I emailed you) but I don't
need to extend any further than that. I showed from Scripture (only a
few examples mind you) why I believe as I do and don't need to go any
further than that. You're right and thanks for reminding me about this.
Admittedly, I had been wondering to myself whether I should debate him
on the subject or not and my gut feeling was that I should just let it
drop and answer any other questions he may have whose answers he is
willing to accept. We are a good combination (a teacher and an
apologist) but I think it best to "stick to my own knitting."
Appreciate it professor and forgive me for bringing you into this. I
also appreciate your quick responses. You're very fast!
Your brother in Christ,
Response #2:
It's my pleasure, my friend.
I'm happy to hear you say that you had scripture to hand for refuting
this false teaching. As you know, no doubt, there are plenty of anti-OSAS
postings at Ichthys (one of the major ones as noted before:
Peter # 27: Three False Doctrines), and lots of
scriptures which make it quite clear that a believer cannot do whatever
he/she wants with impunity (see also: in
BB 3B: Apostasy and the Sin unto Death). That's probably why
Reformed theology would say of those who apostatized "they were never
really saved in the first place".
Re: "once a person has clarified that they don't want it, it isn't
good to keep pestering them about it", that would seem to be
obvious, but in the evangelical world being obnoxious about "sharing" is
one of the hallmarks. Between never engaging and shoving it down
people's throat's one finds the biblical "sweet spot", which is where
you are. Those who are trying to walk closely with the Lord and do what
He wants are always weighing things to discern if we are too far to one
side or the other, and that is biblical too.
Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by this renewal of your thinking, so that you may discern what God's will for you is, namely what it is good, well-pleasing, and correct [for you to do].
Romans 12:2 (cf. Rom.2:17-18)
(9) And this is my prayer: that your love may abound more and more in full-knowledge and in all discernment, (10) so that you may be able to evaluate the things that are good and appropriate [for you to do] to be sincere and without offense in regard to the day of Christ (i.e., to gain a maximum reward at Christ's judgment seat), (11) full of the righteous production Jesus Christ [commends] to the glory and praise of God.
Philippians 1:9-11
Solid [spiritual] food is for the [spiritually] mature, those who by [diligent] practice have trained their [moral] perceptive faculties to [properly] distinguish between good and evil.
Hebrews 5:14
In terms of "works", it really would be getting hyper-theological to get into the question of "is faith works"? There, one probably only needs to quote scripture:
For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast.
Ephesians 2:8-9 NKJV
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #3:
Hi Bob,
Thank you for letting me know. You, your family, and ministry are in my
prayers, as well. Thank you so much for keeping ___ in your prayers. He
is doing better .
Those that don’t believe in eternal security, once you are sealed with
the Holy Spirit, often have anxiety about various things. I am on the
fence and don’t worry myself about it either way.
The important thing is that we trust in our Lord Jesus Christ to do
right by us. He wills that all would be saved. He is merciful and long
suffering. He intends good for us and not evil.
God will work all things for our good because we love Him. We love Him
because He first loved us, while we were yet lost sinners, dead in outer
trespasses.
Even for those they don’t believe in eternal security, we all must
understand that God won’t let us go so easily.
Praise our dear Lord forever.
Response #3:
Thanks for the update! And also for the prayers – much appreciated.
You are right: we are absolutely secure . . . just as long as we stay
faithful, retaining our faith in the Lord. Because all believers are
saved but ONLY believers are saved (Jn.3:18).
This is a faithful saying:
For if we died with Him,
We shall also live with Him.
If we endure,
We shall also reign with Him. If we deny Him,
He also will deny us.
If we are faithless,
He remains faithful;
He cannot deny Himself.
2nd Timothy 2:11-13 NKJV
Given the level of deception about to fall upon the world, that is an important principle to get right.
"For false messiahs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect."
Matthew 24:24 NIV
Yesterday doesn't matter. What counts is whether or not we are following
the Lord in faith today and whether or not we stay
faithful tomorrow . . . until the Lord returns.
Re: "Even for those they don’t believe in eternal security, we all
must understand that God won’t let us go so easily." That's right! A
believer would have to definitively and deliberately turn away from the
Lord, defying and resisting all His gracious attempts to recover the
"lost sheep", in order to end up in full blown apostasy (see
the link).
"I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all; no one can snatch them out of my Father’s hand."
John 10:28-29 NIV
This is a great level of protection. A believer has essentially to pull him/herself out of God's embrace in order to be lost – no one else can "do it to us". Of course, a believer who is straying far from the Lord and refuses to relinquish highly immoral behavior which tarnishes his/her witness may be taken out of this life early and painfully (the sin unto death: link), but at least such a person is still a believer.
“For what profit is it to a man if he gains the whole world, and loses his own soul [i.e., life]? Or what will a man give in exchange for his soul [i.e., life]?"
Matthew 16:26 NKJV
Nothing is more important than salvation. Given the pressures to apostatize in the soon to come Tribulation, to take the mark to avoid persecution, all the more reason for everyone who follows Jesus Christ to make the most of the intervening time to prepare as much as possible spiritually in order to have the resources of truth in the heart to endure until the end.
"Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved."
Matthew 24:12-13 NIV
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #4:
Hello, just found your site. Glad to see you aren't pushing the pre trib myth. It seems like some are more enthralled with it than they are Christ. My question is, are those teaching this belief fall under the classification of false teachers? It seems like a gray area, or maybe it isn't. Thanks
Response #4:
Good to make your acquaintance.
All incorrect teaching is a problem. Spiritual growth builds an edifice of
maturity in the heart, one "brick" of truth at a time. Leaving out anything the
Lord wants us to know is problematic. Replacing "good brick" with something bad
or with something that can potentially undermine the edifice as a whole is
really dangerous.
Pre-trib is one such wrong "feel good" teaching because it tends to make
believers complacent about the very real possibility that they will find
themselves in the Tribulation. If you "know" you won't have to endure it, then
why bother to prepare for it? And of course all truly growing believers do face
personal tribulation. That is also difficult to handle without proper spiritual
growth.
There's a great deal about all this at Ichthys. Here's one link on the above:
Peter # 27: Three False Doctrines.
In Jesus,
Bob Luginbill
Question #5:
Greetings,
If there is one word that has introduced more confusion surrounding the timing
of the rapture, it is the word “imminent.” If I said to you, ”The rapture is
about to happen,” you would say there is no way I could know that, and you would
be right. But that is exactly what imminent means, “About to happen, close at
hand, shortly, impending.” If I am coming to visit you and am four blocks away,
my arrival is imminent, about to happen. It has to happen since I am so close.
It can't be forwarded to the following day if it didn’t happen today. You can’t
keep rolling over imminency. A continual forwarding of the rapture that hasn't
happened is not scriptural and breaches the meaning of it. I think the big
mistake many make is not understanding that Paul never separated the rapture
from the second coming (2 Thes. 1:6 – 2 Thes. 2:1). This is why we can say the
rapture WILL BE imminent at the second coming (Lue 21:28). In the meantime,
there's no reason for pretrib saints not to start saying, "The rapture is about
to happen" since it means the same thing as imminent.
Lord bless, great website
Response #5:
Dear Friend,
Good to make your acquaintance – and thanks for the encouraging words!
It is certainly true that this word group, "imminent / imminency" is not helpful
in these discussions (see
the link). It's not a biblical word, after all. We are told that "the time
is near" (Rev.1:3; 22:10), but as you say that has been true since John was
first given to pen those words. The fact that the time is near does not mean and
cannot mean that there can't be a seven year Tribulation between then and now
just as was true 2,000 years ago. That is an excellent point.
Feel free to write any time!
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #6:
Greetings brother Bob,
Thanks for your kind reply. Your site is great and so much to read. Do you have
a specific place which deals with "tribulation saints?"
If not, I would appreciate hearing what you think about them and if there are
scriptures that support this. Thanks
Lord bless,
Response #6:
Do you mean, is there anything at Ichthys which speaks specifically to the fact that there are believers on earth during the Tribulation? The answer to that would be "no", because everything about the Tribulation in scripture is given to believers, and much of it describes the experiences of believers during the Tribulation. All one has to do is to read our Lord's words in Matthew 24 to see that clearly. For example:
“Then two men will be in the field: one will be taken and the other left. Two women will be grinding at the mill: one will be taken and the other left. Watch therefore, for you do not know what hour your Lord is coming. But know this, that if the master of the house had known what hour the thief would come, he would have watched and not allowed his house to be broken into. Therefore you also be ready, for the Son of Man is coming at an hour you do not expect."
Matthew 24:40-44 NKJV
Only one is taken, the other is left behind. And all of us are supposed to be
ready in that context, meaning believers. The book of Revelation is the same
way, that is, it is constantly demonstrating that there are believers present –
otherwise, whom would the beast oppress (e.g.)?
Apologies if I've misunderstood. Do feel free to write me back.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #7:
Hello Robert,
My mistake, I misstated what I meant to say: Pretrib theology teaches that
"tribulation saints," those who get saved after a pretrib rapture, will go
through the tribulation, not the church. This a major argument for those who
hold to the pretrib narrative.
Lord bless,
Response #7:
No worries.
It's a confused "argument" on its face, isn't it? It's not actually an argument
FOR thinking there is a pre-Trib rapture. Actually, it's a dodge to explain
where all the believers in Revelation and Matthew and elsewhere come from if all
believers are "raptured" before the Tribulation starts. Calling these
individuals "tribulation saints" just puts a band-aid on the inconsistency and
doesn't avoid begging the question, "Well, where DO these 'saints' come from?"
How do they get saved and from whom do they learn enough truth fast enough to
either survive the Tribulation or withstand martyrdom? This thesis also doesn't
explain the one third of believers who are swept away into the Great Apostasy
spoken of in 2nd Thessalonians 2:3 and elsewhere (see
the link).
In fact, of course, neither Revelation nor any other biblical passage dealing
with the Tribulation gives any indication whatsoever of any sort of replacement
effort or revival during the Tribulation. Which leads to the natural supposition
that the believers in the Tribulation were, for the most part, believers before
it started. And that is correct. There is no resurrection before the Lord's
parousia, His return, and scripture is consistent about that throughout.
As I say at many of the links which deal with this subject (here is a rather
recent link which will
lead to more), there is not a single, solitary verse in the Bible which
definitively teaches a "pre-Trib rapture". Not one. And all passages taken by
adherents as indicating its existence, upon inspection, have nothing to do with
any such things – something obvious by any fair reading of the Bible in English.
So it is amazing that this being the case so many still want to hold onto this
false teaching so vehemently. But it is the ultimate "feel good" false doctrine.
Don't worry about hard times ahead! Don't bother with getting serious about the
Lord or the Bible or your Christian walk! It's not like you're going to have to
go through the Tribulation after all! If you were, you might want to consider
building up your faith in order to be able to persevere. But as it is, no
worries!"
Coupled with the false doctrine of "absolute eternal security no matter what
even if you follow antichrist", this pair of dangerous teaching has put the
Laodicean church-visible into a very bad position this close to the end; then
add to this "institutional security" (i.e., "I'm a member a ___ church so I'm
going to heaven no matter what because of that, even if my church teams up with
antichrist's religion"), and we see so many of our brethren set up for a
terrible fall (see the link: Peter #27: Three False
Doctrines that threaten faith).
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #8:
Thanks brother Robert. You're spot on. The great mystery to me is that so many
godly brothers and sisters are pretrib. I can understand that they trust what
their pastors are teaching, even though they should be Bereans themselves, but
how can it be that these pastors have gone down the pretrib path and bought the
Darby error? I have to believe they are otherwise sound in all the other
doctrines they teach, or most of them anyway. But why this one? Big mystery to
me.
"Great making your acquaintance" and Lord bless you and ICHTHYS.
Response #8:
My pleasure, my friend.
Re: "otherwise sound in all the other doctrines they teach" – teaching.
That is the rub. If they are not teaching, if they are only sermonizing for a
few minutes Sunday morning (link),
then there is no particular cause for them to be delving deeply into the Word of
Truth. And if the congregation is fine with that, then they are not growing
either.
Spiritual growth is an every day thing . . . when it is actually happening. But
this is Laodicea (link);
and very, very few places are doing anything that might result in any serious
growth in the first place, let alone lead to a reassessment of serious doctrinal
errors (of which there are many in the contemporary, evangelical
church-visible).
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #9:
Hello again Dr Luginbill,
I had another question if you don't mind. It is about the great multitude that
appears in heaven in Revelation 7:9. In verse 14, one of the elders sitting
around the throne tells John that "they are the ones who have come out of the
great tribulation." Doesn't this point to the rapture happening during the
events of the sixth seal being opened?
Thank you for your time,
Response #9:
Short answer: no.
Explanation: the seals give us the trends of the Tribulation. None of the action
described in them actually occurs until after the Tribulation begins. They are
like the dust cover on a book which gives the reader a preview of what is
inside. The Tribulation cannot and does not begin until the seventh seal is
broken open by the Lamb. Then the events begin. The fifth and sixth seals give
us the trends of the second half of the Tribulation, with the fifth previewing
the tribulational martyrs who refuse to worship the beast ("the souls of them
that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held":
Rev.6:9 KJV), and the sixth previewing the events of Armageddon. When the
seventh seal is opened, the Tribulation begins. Here is a link to where the
seals are covered in the CT series:
CT 2B:
"The Seven Seals".
Since they are "slain for the word and for the testimony which they held"
(Rev.6:9 KJV), they certainly have not been "raptured", removed from earth
miraculously. Rather they have been executed by the beast. This persecution of
the believers, the Great Persecution, does not start until the after the
Tribulation's midpoint (see
the link). So both in terms of timing and in terms of how these believers
are removed from earth, this even clearly has nothing to do with the imagined "rapturing"
of believers from the earth beforehand. This is confirmed by the language of
Revelation chapter seven where we see a bit more detail about these martyrs
introduced to us in chapter six. Revelation 7:19 states that "These are they
which came out of great tribulation" (KJV). The Great Tribulation is the second
set of 42 months which does not start until antichrist takes his seat in the
temple in Jerusalem (2Thes.2:4), having just gained complete control of the
world during the first 42 months (or as it says in Daniel 9:27, "in the
middle of the week"). Please see the link:
CT 4: "The Great Tribulation".
There is no taking up of believers in resurrection until the Lord returns. At
His second advent, all believers still alive on earth will be resurrected, "raptured"
if one prefers, bodily changed and lifted up "to meet the Lord in the air" as it
says in 1st Thessalonians 4:17, a passage which agrees entirely with what our
Lord told us about this event, coterminous with His parousia, in Matthew
chapter 24. All the biblical passages which speak about this event, the actual
resurrection of the Church, are entirely in agreement, a fact that makes the
very dangerous and completely unsupported notion of another
resurrection prior to this time all the more curious; but then we know that the
evil one is always trying to sow confusion: getting believers to think that they
have no need to concern themselves with the Tribulation (so that they may go
into it spiritually unprepared) is no doubt part of his strategy.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #10:
Thank you for that information.
I thought the martyrs mentioned in Rev 6:9 were all those believers who died for
their belief in Jesus between the time of Christ and present day. Then in Rev
6:11 it sounds like their "fellowservants...and their brethren" would be the
martyrs yet to die in the actual Tribulation. Which it seems like the
Tribulation must at least officially begin with the fourth seal because a
quarter of the Earth's population will be killed by the rider of the pale horse.
And if we are to take Daniel 9 literally, then the 70th week would encompass the
Roman prince's decision to end Jewish sacrifice to God in 70 AD and obliterate
the Jewish custom of sacrificing to God, in blood, for their sins, as atonement.
So we must consider that it is literal and not some figurative made-up number.
If this is so then Daniel 9 is not referring to the end times at all, but to the
Roman destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD. I am just figuring this out based on a
literal translation of the biblical teachings. Thank you
...might be mid-trib after all... please have hope
God has been talking to me. He loves you
Response #10:
To return to the martyrs of Revelation chapter six, as mentioned (see prior
link), the seals give a preview of the contents of the scroll and the scroll is
THE "Revelation of Jesus Christ", that is to say, all of the events that will
take place in the future at the end of which our Lord is fully "revealed" to the
world.
In other words, just as the first four seal previews deal exclusively with the
future Tribulation, and just as the sixth seal does as well, and just as the
seventh seal's opening begins the Tribulation, so the content of seal #5 is
future, dealing with events which will take place during the Tribulation. The
reason for the two contingents in Revelation chapter seven, those present in the
third heaven and those yet to be martyred, has to do with the fact that the
martyrdom is not confined to a single point of time during the Great Tribulation
but continues throughout its length. The Great Persecution is what makes the
second half of the Tribulation "great" (literally, "big" in a bad sense here
clearly). But that the seals must refer to things yet future which only
transpire once the book is opened (and the Tribulation begins), our Lord Himself
makes clear to John when He says . . .
After these things (i.e., the events of the Church Age as given in synopsis in the messages to the seven churches), I looked, and behold, a door standing open in heaven. And the first voice which I heard was like a trumpet speaking with me, saying, “Come up here, and I will show you things which must take place after this (i.e., during the Tribulation)."
Revelation 4:1 NKJV
Therefore for this reason as well the seals must represent future events which
take place after the completion of the Church Age. Finally, if the martyrs were
retrospective, they would be the only retrospective element in the entire book
of Revelation.
Re: "it seems like the Tribulation must at least officially begin with the
fourth seal because a quarter of the Earth's population will be killed by the
rider of the pale horse". As explained, these first four seals are previews
of trends that begin sequentially but encompass the entire Tribulation. So, for
example, trend #1 is antichrist's career of world conquest which begins as soon
as the seventh seal is broken and the Tribulation begins. The high mortality
rate brought on by all of the tribulational trends (seal #4), has no bearing on
trying to make the martyrs retrospective or find a "rapture", whether "pre" or
"mid".
Re: "if we are to take Daniel 9 literally, then the 70th week would encompass
the Roman prince's decision to end Jewish sacrifice to God in 70 AD". By
literally I suppose you mean "according to my interpretation".
There is nothing about "70 A.D." in Daniel. Furthermore, there were no
legitimate sacrifices taking place in Jerusalem in 70 A.D. That is the main
theme of the book of Hebrews. Once our Lord's sacrifice on the cross was
completed, all animal sacrifices were abolished as far as God was concerned.
That they were continued by unbelievers who did not accept Christ as their
Savior has no particular prophetic significance.
Most conservative exegetes take the seventieth week in Daniel chapter nine as
prophetic, speaking of the Tribulation. I don't know of anyone of any particular
reputation who takes it as fulfilled historically in the past (link).
And if it had been, then it wouldn't have any bearing on the Tribulation at all.
As it is, it says "in the middle of the week", meaning, the last seven years of
the Jewish Age which have not yet even begun.
If you mean that there is anything of significance between a putative correlation
of the 70th week and A.D. 70, that is biblically impossible because the numbers
being the same is merely coincidental. The system of A.D. vs. B.C. date
calculations wasn't even invented until the early sixth century so that these
numbers are for our purposes of interpretation entirely arbitrary and bear no
relationship whatsoever to anything in the Bible or biblical prophecy. They
simply cannot because they didn't even exist when the Bible was written.
How any of this would result in "[there] might be mid-trib after all", I
do not see in any case.
God speaks to all believers . . . through His Word and the Holy Spirit who
empowers our understanding of it.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #11:
By saying taking Daniel's 70 weeks literally I mean a literal 70 weeks,
not one week equals seven years. That would be 62 literal weeks from the
decree to rebuild Jerusalem to the Messiah being slain or cut-off. Then
7 weeks after he rose from the grave to his ascent to heaven. Then 1
literal week when the Roman prince makes a covenant with Israel and ends
their customary sacrifice, which would most likely be because God was
displeased with the Jews still making sacrifices after Jesus was slain
on the cross.
It seems a stretch to assume God meant 1 week equals 7 years. That would
be difficult for the Jews and Daniel to understand. He would probably
want them to know the exact time frame he was talking about.
There is no passage in the Bible that says the Tribulation will be seven
years long. It only says the Great Tribulation will be 3.5 years long.
The rest is an assumption and most likely a misinterpretation of Daniel
9's 70th week
Thank you,
Response #11:
Nothing was decreed about the temple by anyone a year and a quarter before our
Lord's crucifixion. Also, in our Lord's day, the temple was standing and had
been for centuries, the very one decreed by Cyrus to be rebuilt. Further, the
text of Daniel 9:24-25 actually says "there will be seven ‘sevens,’ and
sixty-two ‘sevens", so 69, not 62. The decree mentioned in that passage is the
decree of Cyrus to rebuild the second temple (in ca. 485 B.C.: Ezra 4:6-23). In
case you are interested, this is all explained
at the
link in CT 3B. There is also nothing in the Bible or history about
any covenant in 33 A.D., the year of our Lord's crucifixion and resurrection.
Also "seven weeks" is 49 days. Acts 1:3 says that our Lord ascended after 40
days (not 49).
Re: "It seems a stretch to assume God meant 1 week equals 7 years. That would
be difficult for the Jews and Daniel to understand." That is true about most
of Daniel and also about much of the eschatology in the Old Testament. That is
true of the cross and the first advent (cf. 1Pet.1:10-12). That is why the
Spirit gives Paul to call this "a mystery". But the mystery of Christ and the
salvation of the gentiles and the whole out working of the plan of God has now
been revealed to us by the Spirit in the New Testament.
He replied, “Go your way, Daniel, because the words are rolled up and sealed until the time of the end."
Daniel 12:9 NIV
It is also true that using "day" for a longer period of time is well attested in
scripture. After all, there are "seven [literal] days" in the reconstruction in
Genesis, but these also represent seven millennia in the plan of God for human
history. Also, the "Day of the Lord" includes the entire Millennium (see
the link). So understanding "sevens" as years is not unprecedented,
especially since there is in the Hebrew no actual word for "day" or "year". We
have to understand "seven what?" from the context. And the context makes it
abundantly clear for anyone paying attention, that these periods must be years
in Daniel chapter nine (because of the long periods of time necessary to
accommodate all the events which prophecy comprises).
Again, the word "day" doesn't actually occur in that passage. Literally it says
"sevens" so that there is no "day" to cause confusion. A "seven" is also a
"week" in Hebrew and a "week" has seven "days"; that is where the "day" part
comes from in various translations. We fill in "years" for the 70 "somethings"
because that is clearly what is meant in the prophecy fairly read even in
English.
Then he (i.e., antichrist) will confirm an agreement (or "covenant"; Hebrew, ברית, beriyth) with the powerful [in Israel] during [that] one [remaining] week (i.e., the 70th week, the Tribulation), but in the middle of the week (i.e., just prior to the Tribulation's mid-point) he will put a halt to sacrifice and offering (i.e., eliminating Moses and Elijah and interrupting the temple rites). And on account of the extreme [nature] of [his] abominations, he [will] be causing desolations (i.e., desertion and estrangement from God), even until the end when what has been determined will be poured out upon the one characterized by [this] desolation (i.e., the beast as archetype and cause of the alienation and rebellion from God which he fosters)
Daniel 9:27
It's not much of an event for a covenant to last half a literal week. In fact
everything about this passage makes it very clear that we are not talking about
literal days or weeks. How can the temple be rebuilt in that period of time?
That is why I have never ever heard of any exegete, even secular and unbelieving
ones, taking this passage that way.
Here are some links on this, if interested:
Re: "There is no passage in the Bible that says the Tribulation will be seven
years long". Of course Daniel 9:27 does have a "week" or a "seven" and as
explained the "seven" has to be years in the context; it can be nothing else as
demonstrated above. So taking that passage off the table would be like taking
the creation of Adam and Eve out of Genesis and claiming they never really
existed. The Bible only has to say something once for it to be true.
But there are other verifications in scripture. It is true that the Bible
focuses on the Great Tribulation, so that most of the "three and a half years"
passages and the "forty two month" passages are talking about the second half.
Please note that what is said to happen in the second half does not include all
of the things that happen in the first half, notably in Daniel, the Olivette
Discourse in the gospels, and most notably in the book of Revelation. So since
there is a second half, there also has to be a first half where all of the other
events of the Tribulation take place (everything in Revelation before chapter 13
too).
"And I will appoint my two witnesses, and they will prophesy for 1,260 days, clothed in sackcloth.” They are “the two olive trees” and the two lampstands, and “they stand before the Lord of the earth.
Revelation 11:3-4 NIV
1,260 days is 42 months is three and a half years – the first half of the
Tribulation . . . because clearly the two witnesses are killed later in the
chapter and then the Great Persecution begins. So their ministry and that of
the 144,000 takes place chronologically in Revelation during the first half of
the Tribulation (which the passage above tells us is the first half of the seven
years).
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #12:
Thank you for that insight. I just found out the decree to rebuild
Jerusalem was around 444 BCE. That means 62 weeks, with one day being
one year, lines up almost perfectly to put us at Jesus first advent. It
seems the 70 week prophecy works both literally and figuratively,
applying to Israel back then and current believers in modern day.
Amazing. The 70th week may in fact refer to both the 70 AD desolation in
Jerusalem and the 7 year tribulation. Thank you very much.
Semper Fi,
Response #12:
My pleasure.
Re: "I just found out the decree to rebuild Jerusalem was around 444
BCE. That means 62 weeks, with one day being one year, lines up almost
perfectly to put us at Jesus first advent." This is a common set of
mistakes. Actually, 62 x 7 is 434, not 444, and that is enough of a gap
for this date not to work on its own. And the verse actually says the
following in most versions:
“Know therefore and understand,
That from the going forth of the command
To restore (but see below) and build Jerusalem
Until Messiah the Prince,
There shall be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks."
Daniel 9:25a NIV
So we need to include the additional seven weeks as well. Now we have 434 plus 49 equaling 483 years. The key is to understand that the traditional rendering above "restore and build" is incorrect. Daniel actually says the following:
So know and understand that from the issuing of a decree to desist [from rebuilding Jerusalem] (in ca. 485 B.C.: Ezra 4:6-23), and for the rebuilding of Jerusalem (beginning forty-two years later in ca. 443 B.C. and taking an additional seven years to complete: cf. Ezra 7:11-28; Neh. chap.1-6) until Messiah the prince there will be seven weeks (i.e., between the decree and the rebuilding) and sixty-two weeks (i.e., between the rebuilding and the birth of Christ in ca. 2 B.C.).
Daniel 9:25a
So the first date, the date from which we subtract the 483, is 485 B.C.
when Xerxes commanded the building commissioned by Cyrus the Great (in
ca. 539-537 B.C.) to stop. That is what lehashibh (לְהָשִׁיב)
means here. The two verbs split the time between the ceasing ("to
desist") and the rebuilding ("and [then] to [resume] build[ing]").
What all this means for our purposes is that with both the 62 and the 7
weeks now historically completed, only one week remains, seven years:
the Tribulation. This is certainly confirmed by the events that Daniel
records for "the middle of the week" with the breaking of the
covenant, that is, the agreement that antichrist makes with the secular
state of Israel in the early days of the Tribulation. At its midpoint,
he breaks the treaty and ensconces himself in the newly rebuilt temple
after the murder of the two witnesses. This is confirmed in 2nd
Thessalonians chapter two, for example.
Re: "The 70th week may in fact refer to both the 70 AD desolation in
Jerusalem and the 7 year tribulation." As explained before, no
significance can be attributed to "70 A.D." on account of its number.
The A.D. / B.C. system of calculating years was not even invented until
the 6th century by Dionysius Exiguus. Before that, even over five
hundred years after the birth of Christ, everyone in the west used A.U.C.,
dating years from the traditional founding of Rome (753 B.C. in our
system). So there could have been no prophetic significance for the
number "70" since it is an essentially arbitrary number. Our system, by
the way, is off by a year or two (depending on your perspective) because
Christ was born in 2 B.C. (there is no year "zero" which would have made
more sense than going from 1 B.C. to 1 A.D.).
The Tribulation lasts seven years and, if the seven millennial day
theory be correct, is likely to start soon, since the cross and
resurrection occurred in 33 A.D.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #13:
Thank you Sir.
Is the trumpet in Matthew 24:31 the same as the 7th and last trumpet in
Revelation 11:15 and 1 Cor 15:51? It seems to point to the dead and
living believers getting their new immortal bodies at that point.
Response #13:
My pleasure.
(30) "Then will appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven. And then all the peoples of the earth will mourn when they see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory. (31) And he will send his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other."
Matthew 24:30-31 NIV
For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever.
1st Thessalonians 4:16-17 NIV
The trumpet call in Matthew 24:31 accompanies our Lord's second advent return in the previous verse. As can be seen by comparing it to 1st Thessalonians 4:16-17, both passages are talking about the call to resurrection that will take place when our Lord returns at the end of the Tribulation (His parousia [see the link]). And, yes, this is indeed the same event described by Paul in 1st Corinthians 15:51-52:
Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed—in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed.
1st Corinthians 15:51-52 NIV
Revelation 11:15 however is not "the last trumpet" but "the seventh trumpet" in a series of seven warning judgments which terminate at the Tribulation's mid-point (after the murder of the two witnesses). The seventh trumpet brings the first half of the Tribulation to an end and begins the Great Tribulation, the last period of history prior to our Lord taking up His personal rule on the earth – which is why the elders sing directly after this passage, in anticipating the judgment to come at the end of those 42 months . . .
"We give thanks to you, Lord God Almighty, the One who is and who was, because you have taken your great power and have begun to reign. The nations were angry, and your wrath has come. The time has come for judging the dead, and for rewarding your servants the prophets and your people who revere your name, both great and small— and for destroying those who destroy the earth.”
Revelation 11:17-18 NIV
This is clearly anticipatory since of course at that point there are
still seven chapters in Revelation describing tribulational events
before our Lord's return in Revelation chapter 19.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #14:
But there is no trumpet at the end of the Tribulation in Revelation 19. It
happens at the last trumpet, before any of the bowls are poured out, which
happens right after His Reign on Earth begins in Revelation 11:15..
It seems Revelation 19:11-15 is when Jesus comes down from Heaven to defeat
Satan's armies with His own Heavenly army of angels and resurrected humans, the
ones taken up at the last trumpet. There is no mention of believers, dead or
alive being taken up and given new immortal bodies in Revelation 19. There is
also no mention of a trumpet in Revelation 19, because the last trumpet sounded
in Matthew 24:31, 1 Thessalonians 4:16, 1 Cor 15:51 and Revelation 11:15.. the
countless multitude from the 6th Seal in Revelation 7:14, most likely the new
immortal humans in Revelation 11:18 and 1 Corinthians 15:51. Dead and living
believers were taken up to be with Jesus at the last trumpet, trump of God (1
Thess 4), when they were given new immortal bodies and appeared in Heaven.
I'm just not sure how the countless multitude from the tribulation in the sixth
seal is tied to the dead and living getting new immortal bodies at the sounding
of the last trumpet. Unless there are multiple times humans are taken up and
made new.
According to scripture, the only humans that will go thru the bowls judgments
are those who are non-believers at the 7th trumpet.
Response #14:
Re: "But there is no trumpet at the end of the Tribulation in Revelation 19 .
. . etc. [and including the entire next paragraph]". Nor is there any
description of the resurrection anywhere in Revelation as it occurs. Revelation
20:4-6 only shows believers already resurrected. And so without a direct
description of the resurrection per se as we have in Matthew 24, 1st Corinthians
15 and 1st Thessalonians 4, there is no need (nor place) to describe the trumpet
call which accompanies it. That doesn't mean it doesn't happen any more than it
means that the resurrection does not happen in Revelation 19 where we are told
that "the Bride has made herself ready".
Revelation is already a very long book by New Testament standards. God could
have included all eschatological information therein, but for reasons known only
to Him not everything is in there. We are supposed to glean everything from the
whole Bible and utilize Revelation as the mechanism to "put it all together".
That is what the Coming Tribulation series attempts to do (link).
I worked on that series in one way or another for decades. It's not just guess
work. It involved taking the best from other ministries, formal study in
seminary, and a lot of painstaking spade-work to put together over many, many
years. As I often say, it's not fair to judge it one little bit at a time
because "the whole is greater than the sum of the parts". That is to say,
"everything fits", and only another such complete interpretation where
"everything fits" would be convincing to me as an alternative (and I never seen
anything of the sort myself).
Re: "I'm just not sure how the countless multitude from the tribulation in
the sixth seal is tied to the dead and living getting new immortal bodies at the
sounding of the last trumpet." They're not connected at all. The believers
in Revelation chapters 6 and 7 are in interim state in the third heaven,
awaiting resurrection just as all other departed believers are (link).
Re: "According to scripture, the only humans that will go thru the bowls
judgments are those who are non-believers at the 7th trumpet." If you mean
no believers will be present on earth, that is not the case since these happen
contemporaneously with the Great Persecution and are in fact God's judgment on
the unbelieving world for that persecution of His people in an exactly analogous
way to the plagues upon Egypt for persecuting Israel. So while I do expect
believers to be spared the worst effects of these judgments just as the
Israelites were, everyone on earth will "go through" the bowl judgments in the
sense of "being here" when they happen because the resurrection does not occur
until they are over.
Revelation does have flash-backs and previews (as all extensive narratives do),
but it generally progresses in a chronological way. It starts with the present
(John's vision of Christ); it then describes the trends of the Church Age (the
seven churches); it then gives the preliminaries for the Tribulation and its
overview (the seals); and the Tribulation starts with the opening of the book
(when the seventh seal is broken). Then we have the description of its first
half culminating in the death of the two witnesses (n.b., the pronouncement
beginning at Rev.11:15 takes place at the BEGINNING of the Great Tribulation and
looks forward to its end [this anticipation of victory occurs several times in
the book]); then we have the Great Tribulation after the escape of true Israel
(Rev.12) and the regime of the beast and the Great Persecution (in chapter 13);
finally we have the bowl judgments which are aimed at unbelievers (not believers
who are mostly spared the worst effects as in the plagues on Egypt), the
destruction of Babylon, then Armageddon, then the last judgment, then the
crushing of the Gog-Magog rebellion, then the eternal state (in the last two
chapters): that is all given to us in chronological order with certain events
given retrospective or prospective treatment for the sake of giving us
additional information of which we have need. To this picture we (teachers) are
responsible to bring in everything else scripture has to say about the end times
from wherever in scripture it is given to us.
Honestly, you would do well to read BB 2B Eschatology
at least, the Satanic Rebellion series
followed by the Coming
Tribulation series at best. All of your questions will be answered if you
do. Trying to "figure this out" all on your own is not an easy task and one it's
really impossible to accomplish without a good knowledge of the original
languages, help from other systematic theologies, and many, many years of work.
And of course, you are not going to get to the bottom of eschatology without a
deep knowledge of all of the other aspects of truth in the Bible. You really
have to know it all (more or less) to know anything at all sufficiently to teach
it correctly.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #15:
Bob,
I have just arrived at another piece of discernment from our Lord. We know that
fullness and fulfilment only come from our Lord. We know that without Him life
feels meaningless and empty. We also know that true healing also can only come
from our Lord.
Satan's system on earth promotes mammon as a means to feeling fulfilled. A lot
of people during their lives realise how empty money makes a person feel so they
then go on seeking for something MORE. Satan has noticed this so he has made
counterfeit religions and cults for the ones who walk away from his promises of
temporal riches.
I was writing today about how democracies promise to meet some of the
needs/wants for most of the people. Needs are essential whereas wants are extras
to our needs.They can also be described as 'desires' or more pejoratively as
'lusts'. I wrote about how modern life (through culture and advertising) creates
insatiable desires in people that can never be fulfilled and so leaves people
feeling they want MORE.
It is funny that I immediately thought about something else that I thought was
unrelated but it is completely connected! __ pushed me into taking a herbal
remedy which contained a herb called 'Ashwaghanda'. This herb is being pushed as
some sort of panacea of sorts but I did hear alarm bells when I heard that is
was part of Ayurvedic medicine. Ayurveda is an Indian teaching of 'holistic'
medicine that people are not just treating the body but also the mind and the
spirit at the same time.
Going back to what I said about people having too strong desires in this modern
world. Well what do you know. Ashwagandha is part of a spiritual practise to rid
people of desire altogether! When people take Ashwagandha, a little known but
widely reported side effects is Anhedonia which is the inability to feel
pleasure. Many people have said that taking this has made people severely
depressed as they can't feel pleasure from hugging family or the cosy feeling
you get out of the hot shower or the joy you feel at Christmastime!
So it literally kills any pleasure you are feeling! Someone perceptive pointed
out that killing desire is actually the aim of most Eastern mystical practises.
Some people call it 'embracing the void'. It is like an extreme form of
asceticism where people stop eating and drinking and just sit cross legged
chanting mantras all day. I don't have proof of this but I wouldn't be at all
surprised if these Ayurvedic medicines are specifically designed to help people
into this 'spiritual' state of completely abandoning all desires to enter the
'void' of non-being (which is a highly prized state in religions such as
Buddhism). Just like how South American 'Shamans' take drugs such as Ayahuasca
(which has become very popular of late) to so call 'expand consciousness', it
makes sense that the enemy would also push a drug that closes consciousness down
completely so that people instead find themselves zombified.
I immediately felt a headache, dizziness and nausea after taking it and after
doing my research I felt a lot worse! Suffice to say I have thrown the rest of
the pills in the bin and am praying the side effects will be very short lived.
Just because something grows out of the ground doesn't make it safe to ingest.
Many poisons have a natural origin so the temptation to be so wary of big pharma
that we throw ourselves into the idea of a herbal idyll could be something the
enemy has been planning us to fall into for a long time.
In Jesus,
Response #15:
That is very interesting. I'm leery of taking medicine of any sort, and this
report only confirms that reluctance. Of course, if we NEED medicine and if it
is prescribed by a doctor who knows what he/she is doing, then it would be
questionable to reject what God has provided for us.
Your other observation reminds me of this verse:
Whoever loves money never has enough; whoever loves wealth is never satisfied with their income. This too is meaningless.
Ecclesiastes 5:10 NIV
People always do want more, and more never makes them happy (link).
I do have to quibble with the other part of the thesis just a bit. There may be
a few individuals out there who find that money – or success or power or
pleasure or possessions – does not actually lead to happiness who then turn to
religion as a substitute, but in my observation of life and study of history
these would seem to be the exception. Religion is an "add on" in the devil's
system which facilitates all other vain pursuits and/or directs them in paths
advantageous to him.
In terms of killing desire, that is the true essence of Epicureanism, whose
actual basis was/is the achievement of ataraxia, the absence of anything
"upsetting", and this is achieved in large part through the liberating
"knowledge" that nothing spiritual exists. So truly there is "nothing new under
the sun" (Eccl.1:9).
When it comes to religion, there are many variations on all themes, but they all
have in common their ultimate objective of turning people away from the truth by
offering them cheap substitutes that fit their particular, personal desires.
Antichrist's religion (link)
will bring all of these under one big tent where the only thing missing will be
the ACTUAL truth.
"I am the Way: the truth and the life. No one can come to the Father except through me."
John 14:6
Keeping you in my prayers, my friend!
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #16:
Hello Brother Bob
Wanted to ask if you have ever heard of Euphemia Orthodox ?
Thank you
Response #16:
I read that she was a martyr in the early 4th century. She wouldn't offer sacrifices to pagan gods so she was tortured and fed to the bears in the arena. I wonder how many of us will find ourselves in similar circumstances fairly soon? If we do, we'll not regret one bit of spiritual preparation we've made ahead of time.
And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony, and they did not love their lives [even un]to the death."
Revelation 12:11 NKJV
Hope you had a nice 4th!
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #17:
Hi Mr. Luginbill,
Thank you, I was so relieved that it worked out!
On another note, I am struggling with fear (which we've talked about a lot). I
know I'm not supposed to be afraid since God is in control, but I am. There are
certain foods that I have had to avoid for a long time - I'm trying to slowly
add them in again. When I try to have just a little, the stress comes and it
came hard tonight.
I think I mentioned that when I was younger, I was afraid of a lot - that I
wouldn't go to heaven when I died, that I wasn't saved, that God wouldn't take
me back, etc and I had this terror of dying. I'm trying to get over that and it
has improved, it's just still here. And this anxiety over food isn't good and I
don't want it to run my life.
Mentally, I know it all - don't worry, don't stress, God is in control - but
it's not computing. What do I do to get it past my mind and into all of me?
What do you do when you have a physical response like what I had tonight, just
total stress? I can't automatically make it go away and I do remind myself of
logical/God's Truth but it's not addressing the root issue. And then I think "do
I need Christian counseling?" but I don't want to do anything like that.
I just need some help.
Respectfully,
Response #17:
First, I'd like to point out that while you may not have achieved complete
victory in this area, you HAVE made good progress. That tells me – and should
tell you – that you are on the right course. Some things take longer to set
right and to heal than others do. A first degree burn may heal in a matter of a
week. A broken bone will take longer. And some conditions require a long, hard
road to recovery. It's not a perfect analogy, but we do know that the Lord tests
us and allows things to continue in our lives which are there to help us build
our faith (just like He left certain Canaanites in the land: "They were left to
test the Israelites to see whether they would obey the LORD’s commands":
Judg.3:4). In the end, all of "this" is about faith. We are saved by grace
through faith, and we grow and progress and produce the same way – by trusting
the Lord and His help to us.
This area is a perfect example. It is said of men in combat that everyone is
afraid, but that those who are effective have learned to control their fear.
Similarly in the Christian life, we are all human. We all have physical bodies
which are infested by the sin nature. When we are shocked by an unexpected loud
noise, no doubt most of us react – a physical reaction. Longer standing threats
likewise produce emotional reactions. But mature believers learn to cope with
these situations where our emotions are "telling us" things that are contrary to
what we have believed and know to be true by faith.
Two keys to this. First, we have the Holy Spirit indwelling us. If we are in
fellowship, that is, if we are not failing to confess some sin or other, we can
be sure that He is helping us. Of course, we have to REMEMBER that He is helping
us, that He is in us, that He is God, that He is all-powerful. That there is
nothing that He cannot do and cannot help us do. If we are tempted to be afraid
of something wherein we know that this is irrational or unnecessary, we need to
put the problem in His hands and have confidence, faith, in His help and
deliverance of us. This does take practice. It does take maturity. And the more
truth we have learned and believed, and the better we have become at remembering
it and applying it day by day step by step, the more effective we will be at
making use of His perfect help.
Second, WE have to commit to believing the truth of the Word. If God tells us
something, it is true. And it is true even if we are being "told" something
different by our eyes and ears or feelings or anxious thoughts. If we have
confidence in the truth, no mountain can stand before us. If we have confidence
in our Lord's protection, no threat of any kind ought to bother or worry us.
One day Jesus said to his disciples, “Let us go over to the other side of the lake.” So they got into a boat and set out. As they sailed, he fell asleep. A squall came down on the lake, so that the boat was being swamped, and they were in great danger. The disciples went and woke him, saying, “Master, Master, we’re going to drown!” He got up and rebuked the wind and the raging waters; the storm subsided, and all was calm. “Where is your faith?” he asked his disciples. In fear and amazement they asked one another, “Who is this? He commands even the winds and the water, and they obey him.”
Luke 8:22-25 NIV
Scripture is very clear. The danger was real. But believers who had the Lord right there with them should have realized that asleep or not nothing was going to happen to Him and so nothing was going to happen to them. The fact that they "didn't get it" is part and parcel of the hardness they exhibited before the coming of the Spirit. But we HAVE the Spirit. Not only that. We have the Lord Jesus Christ indwelling us as well as those who belong to Him.
To them God has chosen to make known among the Gentiles the glorious riches of this mystery, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory.
Colossians 1:27 NIV
Whenever we are afraid, don't we realize that Jesus is not unaware of whatever
threat we are facing? He is right here! Right in us! And as God all around us!
And He loves us! If we are in trouble, we don't have to "wake Him up". WE
are the ones who need to wake up.
Please don't beat yourself up overly about this as this area is one where all
believers, even most mature believers, need work. The Christian life is all
about the growth of faith, and for faith to grow, testing of this sort will
always be present from time to time at least. If we are going to get through the
Tribulation, we will all have to work on trusting our Lord more and more. And,
believe me, we ALL have room for improvement on this.
. . . because God has said, “Never will I leave you; never will I forsake you."
Hebrews 13:5b NIV
We have a right to be "strong and courageous" (Deut.31:6), and every day of the
Christian life is an opportunity to take advantage of the great right we have to
trust the Lord more than anything we feel or hear or see. Because HE is the One
who is "doing it", protecting us and delivering us from whatever and from
whomever we need protection and deliverance. And anything that seems otherwise,
is, we must remember, part of His perfect plan for our lives.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #18:
Hi Mr. Luginbill,
Thank you for the encouragement. Sometimes even when I'm on the right course, I
get discouraged. Several days this week were especially hard from an
emotional/health standpoint. I am starting to understand just how much worry I
have wrapped up in trying to reintroduce these foods that I haven't been eating
for many months. I am trying to make progress on this and not allow the stress
to get to me.
Psalm 145 has been an encouragement to me and especially this portion today:
The Lord is trustworthy in all He promises
and faithful in all He does.
14 The Lord upholds all who fall
and lifts up all who are bowed down.
15 The eyes of all look to You,
and You give them their food at the proper time.
16 You open Your hand
and satisfy the desires of every living thing.
17 The Lord is righteous in all His ways
and faithful in all He does.
I wrestle sometimes with the concept of God protecting us, and then "bad" things
still happen. I'm scared of something happening to me, even though I know it
probably won't and I shouldn't be worried. I know that God allows only what is
good in our lives, but some things certainly don't seem good.
I did have two rough days and then today was pretty good, so God did sustain me.
I was thinking to myself yesterday, "I'm super done with this test now". Yet
every time I come out one side of a particularly hard thing, the next hard thing
makes the previous look like a piece of cake (usually)! Or perhaps I just forget
in the middle lol.
I am very blessed through this all, I know that. Thank you for helping me with
the fear thing - I hope to get to the point where that's not a huge issue or my
automatic response.
Hope you are having a good week!
Respectfully,
Response #18:
It's my pleasure, my friend, and I'm happy to hear that you are making progress.
Great passage!
We all get down and we all get discouraged, but it is important to remember that
these are emotional reactions. Our bodies contain a sin nature and it is
constantly competing for our attention. As "captain of the ship" we have a
right, a duty, an opportunity and a privilege to listen to the Lord, to the
truth, to the Holy Spirit instead of what we are feeling – or even what we are
seeing and hearing. In the blink of an eye we will all be together celebrating
our Lord's victory, resurrected and rewarded and with no further trouble of any
kind whatsoever. In the meantime, this life is all about pleasing Jesus Christ,
about trusting Him. We were saved by believing in Him; we grow by trusting Him
and His words to us – and that is how we grow and how we are prepared to help
others. Between knowing and even believing some truth on the one hand and
actually living completely in line with the truth in every step of our walk is
an (often bumpy) growth process – and none of us has come close to perfecting
it. But if we follow in our Lord's footsteps AND if we are determined to trust
Him "no matter what!", we will find that this growth – and our blessed
relationship with Him – happens more quickly and more solidly. So encourage
yourself in the Lord (1Sam.30:6), and never forget what is most important.
Do you not know? Have you not heard? The LORD is the everlasting God, the Creator of the ends of the earth. He will not grow tired or weary, and his understanding no one can fathom. He gives strength to the weary and increases the power of the weak. Even youths grow tired and weary, and young men stumble and fall; but those who hope in the LORD will renew their strength. They will soar on wings like eagles; they will run and not grow weary, they will walk and not be faint.
Isaiah 40:28-32 NIV
Then he said to them all: "Whoever wants to be my disciple must deny themselves and take up their cross daily and follow me."
Luke 9:23 NIV
In Jesus,
Bob L.