Question #1:
Dear Bob,
In the 12/31/2022 email postings you gave the explanation below. This summary
was much appreciated and helpful! Does your website have additional, searchable
summary explanations of other difficult to understand Biblical passages? I have
disciplined myself to read some of your exhaustive works at Ichthys.com. I do
appreciate the detail, but there are times that a short, to-the-point
explanation would be helpful.
Growing in Christ, and want to keep growing,
Response #1:
The answer is "yes and no". Ichthys is a very large site and difficult
to navigate for new users, even though I have done a lot of work on
trying to make it more accessible.
If you're trying to find info on a given passage you could, 1) look at
the translation index
since I sometimes comment extensively on passages I've translated myself
(they'll be in an appropriate context in any case); 2) check
the subject index
for the theme/idea that relates to the passage you're interested in; *3)
there is also a
PDF spreadsheet for places passages are treated, one for the OT and
two for the NT, one for the gospels and Acts then one for the rest of
the NT (courtesy of Peter V.); 4) you can
Google search
Ichthys (see the instructions for that). If all else fails, you can
email me and I'd be happy to point you to anything you may have
overlooked.
Wishing you a great 2023!
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #2:
-Dear Bob-
Wow, what a treasure trove of Biblical study aids! This exactly what I
was hoping for! It is apparent that a great deal of time and effort went
into getting all the cross-references and hyperlinks to properly work.
Thank you for your exhaustive efforts. I do appreciate all you
personally do to “drill down” to the original Biblical message and
intent, as much as possible. Makes me wonder how much more Biblical
insight expositors from the pre-computer/internet era could have
discovered with these modern tools.
I will continue to “dig deep” into the scriptures. Thank you for your
willingness to share the resources of ichthys.com.
Still learning and growing,
Response #2:
Thanks!
Question #3:
My big question is about the Book of James. Right in the beginning of
the Book of James, The Path translates as follows: “But ask in faith,
never doubting, for the one who doubts is like a wave of the sea, driven
and tossed by the wind; for the doubter being double-minded and
unstable. . .” I raised the issue in our session about doubting. In
earlier discussions, my priest has talked about doubt being functional,
sometimes the way to firm up faith. . . She said doubt is not the
opposite of faith. (Fear is, she said.) In one of my Bibles, it says “he
that wavers” and then later: “A double minded man is unstable in all his
ways.” In another Bible, it says “. . .being a double-minded man,
unstable in all his ways.”
___ suggested that doubt may be an inexact translation and urged us to
bring in other translations. To me, being ‘double-minded’ is very
different from being an ardent ‘doubter’!
In any event, I don’t think doubting is necessarily being unfaithful. .
.
So with all your knowledge of languages and Bibles, what is meant by
James in this very evocative passage?
Also, my niece is having some serious health issues right now. Would you
consider praying for her? (She’s really a lovely young woman, and I
don’t like to see her suffering so much.)
My best,
Response #3:
As to "doubt", the word in James 1:6 is the middle voice of the verb dia-krino, a word which in the active voice simplex form (i.e., no "dia-") means "to judge". "Doubt" is not a bad translation; "second guessing" or "hesitating" (to fully believe) would give the idea here. As to doubt, it depends what one or more particularly WHOM a person is doubting. Our Lord reproached Peter for losing his confidence in walking on the water – AFTER Peter had asked Him to be able to do so. The application here is that if we are praying to the Lord, we need to believe that He does hear us, that He CAN do what we are asking, and that in His love and mercy He is not going to let us down. Otherwise, we're just going through some religious ritual like the pagans do. But our God is real – and He really DOES hear us and help us.
Let us then approach God's throne of grace with confidence, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help us in our time of need.
Hebrews 4:6 NIV
As the Peter example above and plenty of other examples from great
believers in the Bible show clearly, no one is perfect on this score. If
we were, we would be able to move mountains – literally. Scripture very
often gives us the "Christian job description" as something we need to
shoot for and strive for, as in first John where we are told that
"Whoever abides in Him does not sin. Whoever sins has neither seen Him
nor known Him" (1Jn.3:6 NKJV). But earlier John had allowed that we are
forgiven when we confess our sins (1Jn.1:9), that if we say we don't sin
we are making God out to be a liar (1Jn.1:10), and that Jesus advocates
for us when we do sin (1Jn.2:1).
So on the one hand we are not perfect; on the other hand we need to be
perfect. This is not a call to any sort of "comfortable Christianity"
but a clarion cry to get cracking in our growth so as to be persons of
deep faith and trust in the Lord, not "doubters".
I read the James passage in a similar way. Clearly, those to whom he was
writing were falling short. This statement is a prod to put out some
effort in spiritual growth so as to fall "less short". When we pray, we
ought to be aware of whom it is we are praying to, and have confidence
in His love and ability to answer our prayers, His willingness to do so,
and the certainty of Him answering – even if not necessarily always at
the time and place and in the precise way in which WE would prefer.
I do promise to pray for your niece.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #4:
Hi Mr. Luginbill,
I apologize for writing again so quickly. Long story short, I have been
struggling with health issues for a year and a half. I have had to
restrict my diet and lately, I started having problems with lots of food
I ate. I found out today I am mildly sensitive to most meat - I should
still be able to have fish and turkey. I have to not eat any of that for
a month and then add food in again.
Do you think this is a test from the Lord? I feel tested. I feel
attacked mentally and tested physically. Or do you think I am being
disciplined?
Sometimes I still feel like I might not be saved. I have thoughts I
don't want, and I wish they would stop - that's why I feel attacked
mentally. But then I also think, "if I wasn't saved, I couldn't
understand some of the things I do from your lessons, cause the Holy
Spirit empowers all that (unbelievers can only understand salvation
until they get saved, then the rest of the truth comes afterward,
correct?) And I remember what you told me the very first time about
someone who has rejected Jesus without any thought of repentance
wouldn't care about Him or salvation. I think I care. But if I am
afraid, have I truly trusted Jesus? I have to tell myself to rest in
Jesus, and I never do. I just try and hope and wrestle on. Part of me
wonders if the thoughts thing is an attack, cause I am not strong there.
Never have been, even as a child I let myself dwell on things that
weren't good.
Sorry to write again.
Response #4:
No worries, my friend.
If you just robbed a bank last week and are determined not to give back
the money, then we could safely assume that you are being disciplined to
get you to change your attitude and your behavior.
But if we are talking about some common sin you feel guilty about from
the distant past, then you are NOT being disciplined for that. Our
Father is a loving and just heavenly Father. He disciplines us for our
good in every way (Heb.12:1ff.). Our human fathers were not perfect,
even the best of them. But what would we think of a father, whose son
threw a temper tantrum at age six which maybe resulted in missing an
airplane flight, who then waited until his son's twelfth birthday then
canceled his party, burned his presents in the backyard, and grounded
him for a year, saying, "Remember that time you cost us that flight?
This is discipline for that!!!" Surely we would consider him insane and
unjust. Unjust, because the punishment doesn't fit the crime, was not
speedily given, and did not take into account the nature of a six year
old. Insane, because the whole point of disciplining our children whom
we love is NOT to exact revenge but to lovingly teach them to do right.
For that to happen, discipline has to be appropriate AND timely. But the
devil is very good at using guilt to try and cause us to misinterpret
the "bad" things that happen to us. If he can get us looking backwards
instead of forwards, his job is at least half done.
Suffering is a part of the Christian life (see, e.g.,
Peter #34: A
Christian Code of Conduct). And while unbelievers only know pain, we
believers can know joy in the face of suffering because we know that the
Lord 1) always provides comfort and encouragement in our trials and
tribulations (Jn.16:33; 2Cor.1:3-7; 1Pet.4:14); 2) always grants us
deliverance and relief (Ps.9:9-10; 9:18; 1Cor.10:13; 2Cor.4:8-9); and 3)
always makes it possible for us to have the proper attitude of peace in
these times (Is.26:3; 30:15; Heb.4:9-11; 1Pet.1:6-7).
As we grow, we learn to trust the Lord more and more and to realize that
even "bad things" are being worked together for good for us who love the
Lord (Rom.8:28). We are only concerned with pleasing the Lord, so if
things are "going wrong", while we are not expected to enjoy that, we
can absolutely be confident that, if we are not mixed up in some chronic
sin or heading in a wrong direction at the moment but instead are
attempting to grow and move forward, then whatever negative is happening
is not our fault, is known to the Lord, and will redound to His glory .
. . IF we handle the test in the right way, trusting Him to bring us
through and not doubting that He will. He will give us victory. He
ALWAYS does for those who wait on his deliverance.
Wait on the LORD;
Be of good courage,
And He shall strengthen your heart;
Wait, I say, on the LORD!
Psalm 27:14 NKJV
He gives power to the weak,
And to those who have no might He increases strength.
Even the youths shall faint and be weary,
And the young men shall utterly fall,
But those who wait on the LORD
Shall renew their strength;
They shall mount up with wings like eagles,
They shall run and not be weary,
They shall walk and not faint.
Isaiah 40:29-31 NKJV
No one is perfect in the technique of resting in the Lord (see
the link); and certainly not in the early going of spiritual growth.
Instead of worrying about your spiritual status, the best policy is
instead to double down on spiritual growth, making it a point to grow in
the Word daily through Bible study (Ichthys), Bible reading, prayer, and
focusing more and more on applying the truth you have learned and
believed. If you do that, even when "the chips are down", then you will
find that all such doubts eventually disappear altogether.
I am praying for you. Please do feel free to write me any time.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #5:
Doc, you say "Occam's Razor" isn't actually a good way of finding out truth about things at all...How do we know then? If the simplest answer in reality isn't usually the right one, how do we make out the truth in the jumbled stew of unlikely possibilities? I get you're only saying that because it can be used to justify God not existing, but it makes trying to find out things via logic like I do (I'm not doing this for spiritual things of course, only the Spirit can reveal those) near impossible if not outright...
Response #5:
I'm not much on "logic" . . . if its illogical. I'm much bigger on
common sense, especially if it is "spiritual common sense", that is,
using the truth we've learned and applying that truth with the help of
the Holy Spirit. Everything supernatural is illogical to materialists.
So there are too many moving parts to use a theory like this one
objectively and have it yield results. Besides, if God has told us
something in His Word, it is true, regardless of logic. If we try to
force spiritual things into a logical paradigm we will risk distorting
the truth because the truth is the truth regardless of our human
constructs or limited understanding.
Common sense "gets" that – especially spiritual common sense. In
apologetic terms, if we can use logical constructs to convince people of
the truth we already know to be true, that might be a useful
application, but getting truth in the first place from a logical process
is questionable. We have the Bible and the Spirit for a reason. Anyone
and everyone can understand the truth through the system of dispensing
it that the Lord has given us for this age: teachers in the Spirit
learning from the Bible and teaching the truth to others in the Spirit (link).
You don't have to be a genius for that – you just have to be humble
enough to accept God's way of doing things and persevere:
Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men, and the weakness of God is stronger than men. For you see your calling, brethren, that not many wise according to the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called. But God has chosen the foolish things of the world to put to shame the wise, and God has chosen the weak things of the world to put to shame the things which are mighty; and the base things of the world and the things which are despised God has chosen, and the things which are not, to bring to nothing the things that are, that no flesh should glory in His presence.
1st Corinthians 1:25-29 NKJV
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #6:
So...in response to your last email I feel like I asked something like this before but I would like to clarify more. I asked if the truth is contradictory...but what I really meant, and this ties into your last email, is the truth logically consistent or not? I understand people's logic can often be wrong, but that's in my experience because of emotional bias, at least most of the time, the other times seem to be because they don't see the full picture of the facts. I'll be humble and admit that I too often become biased in my reasoning because of my emotions, which can be very strong when I'm upset in any way. What I'm saying is I hope I misunderstood your last email when you said "God's Word is truth, regardless of logic". I took it at first to mean that the truth that the Spirit teaches us isn't necessarily logically consistent...believe me I was NOT happy to realize this whole ministry might be a sham because the teacher puts their beliefs over reason. Like I said before, this place is kind of my last bastion of hope at this point. I guess there's always Bible Academy, but I've followed this ministry for over a year and a half now and know how close knit you two are, and what if Omo says the same thing? My sinful nature may want to be free from the restrictions of the Bible when it comes to what I like doing, but I know ut never really makes me happy at all, and my heart cries out for a relationship with God...I don't know if I can keep on living if all my time searching for the truth, going through so many ministries and their "truth" to find the real one is for naught...
Response #6:
I think we've had this conversation before . . . a couple of times.
Let's not be theoretical about this. Tell me a teaching of Ichthys you
find to be "illogical" and we can talk about that. Not much worse than
being theoretical about theoretical logical constructs designed for
application in the material world then applied to the spiritual realm.
That makes my head hurt. Better to take actual cases.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #7:
*sigh* Your email that I responded to made me feel betrayed...like I was being duped into following some lunatic who willfully clings to cognitive dissonance because he would rather believe what was supposedly revealed to him, even though it contradicts clear reality...but who am I kidding, I NEED Ichthys, even if these things turn out to be true, how else will I fix my problems, both morally and in my life, if I don't have some Christian system to believe in? And all the others I've seen have so many flaws in them...I don't know what to say man, my despairing diatribes have told you enough already...
Response #7:
No worries.
The way I have built Ichthys is for it to be focused on making all the
teaching very straightforward so that no one ever has to "guess my
interpretation", and then to back up every teaching with explanations
and with scripture. I'm always willing to explain individual points,
principles and interpretations of verses – just as long as these
inquiries are genuine questions and not merely from debaters who have no
interest in actually learning.
So the only "system" at Ichthys is "what does the Bible say" and not
just in one place but in every place.
Theological constructs are often just as bad as logical constructs and
much damage has been done to the reception of the truth by both. It's a
lot easier to develop a system of logic or theology and then apply it
cookie-cutter like to the whole Bible: all problems solved! Except that
this ends in gross error over and over again. It's a lot harder and a
lot more time consuming to dig out the truth one principle at a time,
one verse at a time, one book at a time, comparing each and every one to
the totality of what scripture says everywhere. That is what I have been
trying to do. IMHO, the results speak for themselves. I think that the
more time you spend reading these materials, the more you will see the
truth of all that.
Keeping you in my prayers, my friend.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #8:
This is just a shortened version of the last 3 emails. This CAN probably work with math and other purely empirical things like the hobby I mentioned...spiritual matters as always require help from the Spirit. The thing I'm talking about is basically a "proper use of Occam's Razor", which I believe at that point it comes to likely be plain common sense when it comes to non spiritual matters, where if there's not a testable alternative theory, I'm talking any other theory would require assumptions and data we literally as far as humanly possible cannot know to be true, even after massive amounts of work we get no lead whatsoever, it's typically best to just throw in the towel and use the one we got. I'm asking your opinion on this because I and I think most people do this all the time without thinking. Is this just as bad as the dreaded "Occam's Razor"?
Response #8:
I don't have any problem with using logic or data or common sense . . .
for any secular or worldly thing. My problem is with assuming this use
of reason can account for spiritual matters. It cannot. According to
materialistic reasoning God cannot even exist. So how can materialists
bereft of the Spirit ever hope to understand His book?
But there is a spiritual dimension to things, a fact which every human
being is given to know early on in life (see
the link). "Science" now rejects this universal spiritual common
sense and makes a collective ass out of itself in so doing. You can't
quantify the Bible so you can't understand it with quantitative
methodology. Using logic for other things is fine. But God gives us a
simple way to learn spiritual truth: obedience to the Holy Spirit and
the system of edification the Lord has provided for us (link).
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #9:
Hi Dr L,
How are you doing?
I finished the Ancient History book finally, and will start on the
Church history one. And I am over halfway on the Greek textual criticism
book. It is odd when I read it, to think that even into the 20th century
there were lots and lots of unexamined manuscripts. It would have made
me think at that time, well how do you know if you have the right text
if there is still so much material. But they have looked at it all now,
right? Are they still finding more?
When I see the news I tell myself, 'I used to think I should study
evolution closer to have an answer at least in my mind to its supposed
challenges to the Bible, but look at the scientific community now, they
will destroy themselves before I get to that point.' (The gender thing,
the vaccine thing, and that kind of stuff). I have read very briefly
about evolution science and I note that it is pure theory- untestable
because you can't go back and check that all the assumptions about the
physical environment were so thousands of years ago. And there are no
records to tell us, unlike with historical manuscripts and documents.
But if I believe text criticism scholars on manuscript dating, I should
learn more. The other issue is that the evolution group is constantly
changing (they would say updating) their story, and so even if I learned
it in one time, wait a while and it will be different. But I don't think
the story of manuscript dating has changed all that much, right?
I feel like I relate to Anna the Prophetess. Because she doesn't seem to
have had a family, and spent her time praying. I think that is good and
useful for some people who don't have the conventional path to follow.
Anyway, happy Friday Eve,
Response #9:
Doing well here – hope the same is true for you, my friend.
On mss., there are a good many Byzantine era mss. which are all related
to the same late family tradition. In the last twenty years or so there
has been a lot of work done in collating them, comparing readings and
the like. Since they are all late and far inferior to the earlier mss.
we have (like Aleph, A, B and C), there isn't much profit, IMHO, to
spending one's life on these things, but some people are doing that
(especially "King James Onlyists" who prefer them because KJV's "Textus
Receptus" was based on one of these;
link). Put it this way, would you rather have four F-35's when
you're going to war or 1,000 WWI Spads?
Your comments on evolution and on Carbon-14 testing are right on the
mark. Here are some Ichthys links for these issues:
Hope you have a nice weekend!
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #10:
Hi Dr L,
If you could just clarify real quick: are you saying that those
manuscripts that the scholars didn't get to until later are mostly later
manuscripts? Because that does make more sense to me. And I agree with
you that it wouldn't be the best use of the average believer's time.
I think I will stop with Greek text crit after this book, and focus on
the Bible, Bible study, Greek, and a bit of history.
[omitted]
Respectfully,
Response #10:
That's correct. We all prioritize work (or should), leaving unessential tasks
until the essential ones are completed (that is essentially what's going on here
in the case of scholars who recognize the inestimably greater value of the
earlier mss. as opposed to the Byzantine era ones).
You are important to Jesus Christ, very much so. There's no better identity than
that. And the more you devote yourself to being close to Him, the better for
that relationship which is beyond all others in this very temporary world.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #11:
Hi Dr Luginbill,
Thanks for all your help.
1) Real quick, I was reading that apparently even in Origen's time there was a
lot of textual variants. Do you have any thoughts/knowledge on how that affects
how we see the early manuscripts that survived?
2) And is there a book that has the basics of hermeneutics (like an overview of
the common hermeneutics interpreters have used). Ok I obviously am not familiar
with the terminology, but hopefully you understand what I am asking lol.
Please take care of yourself
Response #11:
1) That is a speculation since we don't know a lot about what mss. e.g.
Origen (or any of the Greek fathers) had access to; and a generalization
(what is "a lot"?). Also, when I give a rough quote or paraphrase of a
verse in an email response, it doesn't mean that there is variation in
the text I'm referring to. Similarly, a "quotation" in Origen who wrote
in Greek is not necessarily one that he checked against a ms. and for
that reason alone might not reflect a variation. So I wouldn't worry
about this point, whoever wrote it.
2) Yes there are books on Christian hermeneutics but none I could
recommend. To use a generalization myself, they tend to be dead-faith
hyper scholastic or over-simplified evangelical biased (both are wrong
about a great many things). Plus, there is a lot which such scholars
haven't figured out about how to interpret prophecy and that of
necessity clouds their understanding of the text (and adversely affects
their text-critical judgment).
Here's a link at Ichthys which will give some background on that: in
CT 1: "Hermeneutic Issues".
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #12:
Praise God, thank you for sharing the Word of God with us. Family is doing well, not trial-less, but well.
Response #12:
My pleasure!
Question #13:
Happy Thanksgiving Brother Bob, hope you are well.
Thanks for sharing Bible resources. I realize that you have probably
received many emails over the years asking Bible questions. Thanks so
much for your patience and kindness in sharing your insight and the
Scriptures. I was wondering if there is a link to questions you have
answered, and if it is organized by topic?
Love in Christ,
Response #13:
You're most welcome.
To answer your question, there is a huge volume of email postings going
back many years now. Here is the link to the list of them which starts
with the most recent and goes back to the beginning (Previous
Postings). As you will see, they are arranged mostly according to
themes, such as the "Baptism:
Water and Spirit" series (link to the latest one). But since there
are somewhere around 20 plus Q/A's per posting, and since many topics
are more general (e.g., "Old
Testament Interpretation"), it can be a challenge to find something
specific in this great mass of material.
Two helps there are the
Translation Index (where translations original to this ministry may
be found) and the
Subject Index (which will guide you not to every place where a
subject is covered but to most of the more important and detailed
treatments). It's also possible to
search the site
via Google (more effective for searching the email postings than the
larger pieces since Google-bot does not work its way through more than
about twenty pages or so of text files).
If you are ever looking for something specific, I'd be happy to try and
point you in the right direction.
Happy Thanksgiving to you too, my friend!
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #14:
Thank you for that well thought out, moderated, and well spoken
response. I have been praying to the Lord to help me if I am slipping of
the path and I believe He will. I have told you I struggle with what is
the Holy Spirit and what is something else, so I don't know what I can
make with that. But I am praying.
This may seem random, but for a long time I have thought I was really
blessed to get the education I did (though I wish I had done more with
it at the time). There is a new depth to life when you learn so much
books and literature and history and culture. One small thing you might
say is that you can see how to speak or write well, and how to see
through honeyed words and arguments. There is just a lot missed from
what I can see with some people who just scoff at that kind of thing.
Though to be honest, I do wonder about the downsides of reading too much
fiction.
[omitted]
Please take care of yourself. Thank you for always being patient and
helping me.
Response #14:
I certainly agree with you about education – and especially an education
in Classics. There is a reason why for well over two millennia in the
west this was the only sort of education that mattered. Not that people
who had it were perfect, but as you mention, being conversant with the
great minds of the past gives a person more "critical thinking" ability
than half a dozen college courses ostensibly devoted to that subject.
Fiction is fiction. It can be mostly benign, or it can be quite evil in
intent. We are bombarded by this stuff everywhere in our
entertainment-driven culture, so having some background knowledge and
the ability to see through all lies emotionally as well as analytically
is a real plus. Spiritual growth lends us spiritual common sense in this
area as well as in all others.
Wishing you a good week ahead!
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #15:
If we both have the same thing in mind by "classical education" that
does entail a lot of fiction.
I am still working on Greek, but I confess that I feel I am going really
slow. I mean I spend enough time on it (1 hour or a little more on
weekdays and usually the weekend off), but I feel like after a couple
years, I should be reading it much easier. May I ask how long it took
you to read it pretty easily?
[omitted]
Response #15:
I certainly agree with you about education – and especially an education
in Classics. There is a reason why for well over two millennia in the
west this was the only sort of education that mattered. Not that people
who had it were perfect, but as you mention, being conversant with the
great minds of the past gives a person more "critical thinking" ability
than half a dozen college courses ostensibly devoted to that subject.
Fiction is fiction. It can be mostly benign, or it can be quite evil in
intent. We are bombarded by this stuff everywhere in our
entertainment-driven culture, so having some background knowledge and
the ability to see through all lies emotionally as well as analytically
is a real plus. Spiritual growth lends us spiritual common sense in this
area as well as in all others.
Wishing you a good week ahead!
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #16:
Hello Dr. Luginbill,
We had a discussion in Bible class this morning concerning the Apostle
Matthias. My thinking is that the decision to choose Matthias to replace
Judas was incorrect. The basis for my opinion is that so little is known
about him and he is never mentioned again in Scripture. Also, the fact
that Paul came after Matthias, which would make Paul the 13th Apostle.
Although the procedure that Peter followed in Acts 1:15-26 indicates
that Matthias was a reasonable choice from their point of view, it’s not
clear from reading the passage that the Lord actually prompted the
disciples to fill the vacancy in their ranks. On the contrary, by
looking back it seems obvious that Paul was God’s choice to replace
Judas.
Matthias was never mentioned again by any of the disciples, and none of
them raised any objections when Paul described himself as an Apostle
chosen by God. Except for Philippians, Thessalonians and Philemon,
Paul’s letters began with him introducing himself this way. The number
13 is associated in Scripture with rebellion, apostasy, defection,
corruption, disintegration, and revolution.
I would agree with the above statements, but I would like to have your
expert opinion on this.
Thanks always for your great advise.
Blessings to you always,
Your friend,
Response #16:
I agree with you on this point absolutely! In fact, I have taught this
for a long time. There are other indications as well to doubt the
legitimacy of Matthias "appointment", such as the fact that they drew
lots – a procedure which was only valid under the Law and never used or
recommended elsewhere in the NT; and such as the way Luke is given to
describe the results, literally, "he was voted down (i.e.,
condemned) along with the other eleven apostles", i.e., for this
incorrect procedure. No versions translate it this way, but this is what
the Greek says (even Strong's has this as one of the meanings).
Here's a couple of links to where I discuss this:
Matthias and the Numbering of the Twelve Apostles
Peter #2 appendix
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #17:
Dear Teacher
I have been trying to figure out why growing in understanding of the
truth has not yet turned into victory over terrible gross sin. __ was in
tears about a bad habit of "talking out of turn" or something like that
and being rather mean in speech. I said that not to despair but should
focus on spiritual growth since growing understanding in the truth will
ultimately solve that problem. I'm confident that that is true, but I
also wondered whether I'm missing something about the mechanics of the
whole thing since, while I think I have learned the whole system of
truth, I'm persuaded struggling with gross sin is a mark of spiritual
immaturity.
Today, therefore, I decided to really think about it (I believe it was
the Lord who turned my mind to it). I spent quite some time talking
myself through some of the Scriptures that came to my mind and then
reading PE #16 and then the latter part of PE #17. I came to a
conclusion that I want to run by you.
It seems to me that the Bible provides the solution to sin in the
statement "walk in the Spirit and you will not satisfy the desires of
the flesh." This seems to me to mean that "virtue (or spiritual)
thinking", as you called it, or "biblical thinking," as I unwittingly
came to call it too is the way to grow in sanctification in time.
The mechanics of this is that as we learn to think about the specifics
of our lives in a biblical/spiritual/virtuous way, we will begin to
conduct ourselves in ways that are pleasing to God in those things. What
this means is that instead of merely attempting to exert our free will
to stop ourselves from doing things as if willpower is all that is
needed -- a tack that ultimately fails from exertion because of
exhaustion -- we need to learn to think the right way about the specific
matter. For example, in the matter of sexual immorality, it is true that
faith in the Lord tells us to trust Him when He says that we should flee
sexual immorality, and hope in Him tells us to look forward to the
promises He has given us of better things, and love tells us that God is
worthy of our obedience and pleasing Him with our bodies and that our
fellow believers are encouraged by our conduct, but how do we break the
hold upon us?
So, when you say that the Holy Spirit works with the truth in our
hearts, it would mean that the deeper and more specified the truth is in
our hearts, the more we find ourselves empowered by the Spirit to deal
with the specifics.
Just believing what God's position is on these things is enough to put
us in the position to take advantage of the Spirit's power. Until we
believe God's position on the specific issues, it will be a legal
problem to our minds: a matter of what we should or shouldn't do. That
makes the matter a frustrating one. A change of heart about it, on the
other hand, makes it more a matter of skill. Once understanding dawns,
then it is a matter of dexterity in using the power of the Spirit as it
wells up inside us.
For me, it may be too soon to be sure that I have figured it out, but I
feel that I can testify that I had a feeling of calm from just working
all that out. It may be nothing or it could be the beginning of a
permanent change.
From where I stand, it is not that there will be no more fight. Rather,
it is that the doctrine of war changes on the specifics. Instead of
fighting from a position of defeat (such as Rom.8:7-8 seem to me to
indicate), we can begin to fight from a position of victory. That is,
rather than worrying about losing because you are approaching things
from the perspective of why you shouldn't sin, now you are concerned
with how to maneuver because you are dealing with how to beat the
temptation. When you worry about sinning, you start to make
accommodations for inevitable failure or else you start to blind
yourself to failure. When you stop worrying about it, you sort of stop
"thinking" about it. Again, it's probably too soon, but I think that the
calm is really a sense of confidence that you have something solid to
stand on when the fight breaks out again, so you don't feel worried or
stressed thinking about the next fight because even a win in the past is
probably a fluke and you'll lose the next one for sure.
That's it, Sir. What do you think about all that?
Your student in Jesus
Response #17:
Good stuff, my friend!
I would add that it really is all a matter of faith, by which I mean the
decision to believe and follow through on that belief. That is where we
all fall down from time to time. We have all denied ourselves (repented
unto salvation); we have all picked up our crosses (believed in Jesus);
but following Him is often hit and miss. There is much resistance.
Spiritual growth is indeed the solution, but spiritual growth is not
just knowledge – it is knowledge truly believed in the Spirit. And if we
truly have committed to the truth of anything, going against that is
going against the Spirit – and it is obvious to us when we do so.
The Spirit is God. Nothing is impossible for Him. If we really do trust
Him to help us, He helps us. But if we are operating on doubt or neglect
of Him and the truth of which He is reminding us, then we are not
"walking in the Spirit". These are absolute things, but also subtle
things . . . at least until we reach a certain point of maturity when
deceiving ourselves becomes ever more difficult. We have to keep
deciding to do what is right over and over again – until life is over.
Our Lord did this too. Only He never decided anything but to respond to
the Spirit in the right way. And He is our example.
Then the disciples came to Jesus privately and said, “Why could we not cast it out?” So Jesus said to them, “Because of your unbelief; for assuredly, I say to you, if you have faith as a mustard seed, you will say to this mountain, ‘Move from here to there,’ and it will move; and nothing will be impossible for you.”
Matthew 17:19-20 NKJV
If we decide to trust absolutely, then absolutely nothing is impossible,
and especially not gaining victory over sin.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #18:
Thank you, Sir.
I had a problem not merely of believing but also of not knowing. I never
knew until yesterday that the things I had read and reread so many times
also meant what I came to see them to mean yesterday. I didn't really
know any other way to think of sin besides the legal way. If I was not
thinking about it in terms of what you should and shouldn't do and why,
it wasn't obvious to me how I should be thinking about it without
trapping myself in legalism.
Another amazing thing is that this is a strategy that works across the
board. So, on any other problem of sanctification that I have, I know
that what I need to do is question what I believe on the matter and
bring it into alignment with the Scriptures and then hold the course. In
other words, no need to take the legal approach anymore. The question is
not should I? or should I not? or why should I? or why should I not? It
is "what do I believe about this that is causing me to stumble? And what
does the Bible say about it that I'm missing?"
Your student in Jesus
Response #18:
It is indeed a facet of spiritual growth to begin to see things from a more strategic perspective. Or, put another way, to understand what this is all about and have that larger view in mind most if not all of the time: keeping the cross ever in our hearts (rather than around our necks as is the practice of some). Remembering the conflict in which we are involved, getting to know just how "big" God is and carrying that perspective into all our thinking, looking to our reward and not to the here and now, etc., etc. is the method. I do hasten to add, however, that we also can't abandon the smaller "nuts and bolts" truths. All genuine, biblical perspectives are important. As we grow, we get to know better and better "the breadth and length and height and depth" of all of God's truth (Eph.3:18). And we start to see our Lord in all we do at all times.
By faith [Moses] left Egypt, not fearing the king’s anger; he persevered because he saw him who is invisible.
Hebrews 11:27 NKJV
Knowing on a deep level, the level of actually believing in our heart
that we know is true, "epignosis-knowing", is a huge advantage.
But we still have to choose and act through much opposition as long as
we are down here.
Keeping you in my daily prayers, my friend.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #19:
Hello Prof. Bob!
How are you doing? We're chugging along. I wonder if you're going to get
some piping emails regarding the current email topics (submission, women
being deceived). I've said a prayer for your readers to be receptive to
these matters - may we glorify the Lord!
Before I forget, how do you prefer to be addressed? Even my Mom has
heard of Prof. Bob, but perhaps that isn't a preferred name.
I've been studying to better understand the area of application
regarding medical treatment and interventions. Overall, I have peace,
but have been confused by a few points.
1) Our bodies being "temples" of the Holy Spirit; what does that mean?
2) If we ought to approach physical "brokenness" similarly to the rest
of life
3) What does having doubts in Romans 14:23 mean?
1) It doesn't seem "natural" to take medicine given that we have been
entrusted with these mortal vessels. That said, riding in cars and
eating modern fruit is probably not too natural either.
Seeing such care and detail that went into the Tabernacle and Temple,
instinctively my assumption is that we need to go to painstaking efforts
to physically be "as God intended".
That said, these are some verses and considerations I'm taking into
account:
- Mark 7:15, ESV: There is nothing outside a person that by going into
him can defile him, but the things that come out of a person are what
defile him.”
- Although we are "fearfully and wonderfully made", sin has compromised
our physical bodies
- Ephesians 2:14-22 inclines me to believe that the Lord has somehow
enabled those who believe in Him to be fitting temples through HIS
righteousness
- This "temple" reference is largely a collective reference to the body
of Christ
- There are seemingly positive or neutral references to doctors and
medicine in the Bible
I don't want to displease or dishonor the Lord in receiving medical
treatment, nor do I want to potentially miss a means the Lord may use to
avoid a shortened or particularly uncomfortable lifespan.
2) If we have diseased, ill or otherwise quite incompetent bodies, is it
correct to assume we shouldn't just roll over, but soldier on and manage
best we can to find solutions to stay alive and/or functioning?
(All that assumes submitting to the Lord with gratitude, not obsessing,
acknowledging His sovereignty over solutions and the number of our days)
I don't want to "fight" against the mortal body I've been given, but it
also seems failure to be perseverant could be its own failing.
3) Romans 14:23 stumps me, especially if both sides present doubts -
"staying or going"; I think I could intellectually see a potential issue
with anything if I tried.
Life seems full of situations where we may not always 100% be sure if
what we're doing is correct, but we discern best we can based on
Biblical truth, trust the Lord in faith, and -ideally- go on peacefully
abiding in the Lord.
Have a blessed weekend in the Lord and thank you for bearing with our
historically slow responses. We read, appreciate and often discuss what
you send, but are new to this whole "teacher we never met in real life"
thing as well as how to do these things "together but separately".
Response #19:
No firestorm yet! But of course readers of Ichthys have heard teaching
on these things before (cf. Peter #35; link).
To answer your questions:
1) The Holy Spirit indwells us (link).
And wherever God is dwelling is a temple. So this is literally true of
individual believers but also of all believers on earth as a group: we
collectively are the only "temple of God" presently existing on planet
earth (1Pet.2:5). It is true that this point is often abused by
legalistic individuals to want to say that "since your BODY is a temple,
you ought not to drink diet cola (e.g.)". That is ridiculous. Our
physical bodies are assets in the fight we are fighting, so it makes
sense to take care of them reasonably so as to be better in that fight
for our Lord (we would want to do that anyway in our own self interest,
it seems to me). But using this truth to advance non-biblical agendas
(like trying to get people to stop smoking) is an abuse of scripture and
legalistic in the extreme.
2) Accessing medical care – or any technology – is, for the most part, a
matter of application, not of strict commands from scripture. A word
processing program can be used to write a Bible study or a stick-up note
to facilitate robbing a bank, e.g. Technology is, for the most part,
neither good nor bad intrinsically. How we choose as Christians to use
it is the issue. There is no need to drive a horse and buggy instead of
a car – as if there were anything spiritual in that. Forcing believers
to do the former is legalism. Telling someone not to get the Covid
vaccine because it is "a sin against God" would be silly if it weren't
downright evil. Not getting a Covid shot because of health concerns is
reasonable enough. Believers who choose to get one and believers who
choose not to based on purely practical concerns can't be accused in
either case of doing something wrong. It's the other way around:
injecting a spiritual dimension as a matter of principle into such
matters of application is what is wrong (and that is the whole point of
what Paul is saying in Romans 14:1ff.). There is clearly, as is the case
with all matters of applying the truth to life, a "sweet spot" somewhere
between engaging in every possible medical intervention and therapy in a
frantic and fearful fashion on the one hand, and refusing all medical
care whatsoever on the other. Paul was accompanied by a physician; he
relied on the Lord first and foremost but also made use of what the Lord
provided. That is the "rule of thumb"; applying it to any given
circumstance correctly requires us to lean on the Spirit with the
spiritual common sense we have developed through spiritual growth.
3) It is the definition of application situations that we aren't 100%
sure – so that we have to trust the Lord as we make the best possible
decision we can. Since if that is the case, we're not going to be in the
wrong either way as long as we are trusting the Lord (Rom.14:23) –
unless we are blind to some absolute principle which we are overlooking
in arrogance or ignorance. That is rarely the case with medicine for
mature believers. Assisted suicide, e.g., would be something about which
I would say 100% wrong; mostly everything else (there are clearly a few
other clearly questionable things like "gender surgery", e.g.) would be
a matter of making our best choice possible, listening to the Spirit and
applying the truth we have stored in our hearts. Do I or do I not get
physical therapy for this problem joint? On the one hand, it could help;
on the other hand, I'm living with it OK and XYZ might also improve it.
I would have a hard time saying there was any great spiritual import in
deciding something like that one way or another.
Also, in terms of Romans 14:1ff., here we have a case of somewhat more
mature believers "knowing better": they are technically right, but of
making the mistake of offending less mature believers who haven't grown
to the point of understanding certain things as of yet. So if I smoke (I
do not smoke), it would behoove me not to make a point of puffing around
some immature believer I know is going to hit me with that "temple of
the Holy Spirit" verse. I'd just be aggravating him/her, and that is not
right, even if smoking is not biblically wrong (it's not good for one's
health, obviously, but then neither is the chocolate chip cheese cake
I'm planning to have for dessert tonight).
Keeping you and your family in my prayers, my friend!
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #20:
Robert, at the heart of everything for me is this: Why am I repentant?
Because I know that God is the only source of true joy and satisfaction
in this life/world and I know that seeking that satisfaction in other
things/ways when I was struggling in unease with being barraged with
unwanted thoughts and the joyless existence in that and then repenting
from the sin because of guilt and fear of having disobeyed God so badly
like that and going through that repeatedly in cycles.
None of this is an excuse for what I did it's just the reality of
patters of sin that took me far from the Lord and then desiring Him and
repentance and turning from it to end up back in it in again in cycles.
I can definitely see why God after so many times and so much sin would
not want to hear me/my repentance any more (Proverbs 1:28-30). I will
live with the misery of this before I will ever return to sin again. I
just pray that the Lord, the Holy Spirit would help me to know that God
is still listening, still there for me. But that isn't something I can
will to happen just by choosing to believe it.
I am repenting because I have known that joy and satisfaction in the
Lord and NOT because of what I'm currently going through right now. I am
desiring repentance because I am sorry to God for sinning against Him
that way when He has always been there for me since I can remember when
I was small and has helped me through the darkest times of my life.
He has been good to me and the greatest source of comfort and more than
anything I want HIM, not stuff from Him. I don't want to live my life
without God in it and don't want to spend eternity without Him.
Sure, I desperately want Him to help me with __'s problem and my job
loss problem, but those are not the reason why. I do love and thank Him
and want Him more than anything and I don't ever want or intend to go
near any of those sins or any particular sin again.
I am afraid that my repentance is not of the type God will accept. I
can't tell. I really can't tell. You yourself said there comes a point
where true repentance is not possible anymore. And I know you have to
believe what scripture says but I also believe you should be broken over
your sin where you weep over it. The Holy Spirit has not gifted me with
that so I can't tell if I have worldly grief or Godly grief. Maybe
because I've returned to these patterns so many times, the Spirit will
no longer grant me true repentance.
If He does not then I can't be forgiven no matter how much I pray to be.
I can't tell, and I can't just assume. I know what I've been counseled
(by spiritual believers like yourself) and I know what I've read and I
know that God never rejects true repentance, but I can't tell or be sure
that He considers mine to be of the 'true' or 'acceptable' type.
Any insight and help would be greatly appreciated as always. I really
need to settle this once and for all in order to move forward. Because
if God has turned His ear from me (Proverbs 1:28-30), there is no moving
forward for me I suppose. It has to be real, not just something I choose
to decide is reality.
I must really exhaust you and after all this time, frustrate you. I
can't imagine how I've frustrated or even angered the Lord. I'm sorry
for that.
Your friend,
Response #20:
Apologies for the slight delay. Your email came in after closing things
down last night, and it was a long, busy day at work today.
The first thing to note is that you seem to have a dangerously warped
and incorrect view of repentance. I will give you the gist here, but I
strongly counsel you (as I have been doing for years) to read into
Ichthys on this and all other biblical topics (link for this one: in
BB 3B: Hamartiology, section V.1, "Repentance, Confession, and
Forgiveness"). Free will is the highest gift given to mankind as a
whole: the image of God. We all have a right to choose where we spend
eternity, either submitting to God and His truth so as to be saved
through Jesus Christ or rejecting Him, His authority, His truth, and
creating a truth of our own (which means, actually, choosing to believe
one of the devil's many lies instead). Repentance is a change of mind.
Not an emotional reaction, not an orgy of self-flagellation, not crying
and weeping and moaning and groaning. Not that any of us feel good about
getting disciplined by the Lord; not that any of us don't feel regret
about our sins and failure. In fact, it is good and proper to see sin for
what it is, a rebellion against God and His authority: all sin is
lawlessness (1Jn.3:4), i.e., a rejection of God's commandments (cf.
1Jn.2:4).
Repentance is deciding. Repentance is choice. Repentance, true
repentance – which is what you seem to me to have – is a solid decision
to change. That is what the word means in Greek: "change of mind". Not a
flippant or irresolute change of mind, but a genuine turn, as when the
prodigal son came back from his "far country". After that change, we
confess. It's no good to confess if we don't really mean to change. We
have to mean it at the time we confess, and that requires a genuine
prior change of mind.
Understand. God is not impressed by our crying or moping. Very
important: we are not "paying off God" by distressing ourselves. That is
a vicious and an RC concept that needs to be completely spit out. God
does not gain by us abusing ourselves, physically or emotionally. If we
are hurting, He knows that – and He knows why. Better we should rejoice
like David at His forgiveness of us even as we are hurting (Ps.32:1ff.;
51:1ff.). Better we should be confident of His forgiveness. He says He
forgives us (1Jn.1:9). What does it say about our faith if we don't
believe it, if we don't believe Him?
We have all sinned (1Jn.1:10; cf. Rom.3:23). What you are suffering at
the moment in terms of tribulation in your life seems to me – admittedly
a distant observer – is way out of proportion to any discipline for the
long past and already confessed and repented of failures that are still
troubling you. It sounds to me more like maturity testing: testing to
see if you are willing to trust the Lord and push forward with spiritual
growth in spite of the opposition. When such trials come, it is a
natural human thing to look backward and blame ourselves on account of
past failings. But that is not how our gracious and merciful Savior
deals with us. Like the perfect Father He is, our heavenly Father
disciplines us like the sons and daughters we are, in a timely way, in a
merciful way, with the goal of our correction and proper growth in mind,
NOT delighting in our suffering – any more that we would when we see our
children distressed by the necessary discipline we sometimes have to
mete out (Heb.12:3-11).
So this backward looking flaw is a tic we all have to get over
(Phil.3:13). We all have to let the past go, and deal with the present
as it is. We need to learn to be joyful in the midst of tribulation – or
at least to be at peace with it as much as possible – and by all means
NOT let it stop or stymie our spiritual growth. That is exactly what the
devil is trying to achieve. But we are not unaware of his schemes
(2Cor.2:11).
God IS listening to you, my friend. You need to listen better to Him.
The LORD is compassionate and gracious, slow to anger, abounding in love.
He will not always accuse, nor will he harbor his anger forever;
he does not treat us as our sins deserve or repay us according to our iniquities.
For as high as the heavens are above the earth, so great is his love for those who fear him;
as far as the east is from the west, so far has he removed our transgressions from us.
As a father has compassion on his children, so the LORD has compassion on those who fear him;
Psalm 103:8-13 NIV
"Fear not, for I am with you;
Be not dismayed, for I am your God.
I will strengthen you,
Yes, I will help you,
I will uphold you with My righteous right hand."
Isaiah 41:10 NKJV
My advice to you is to 1) accept that you have been forgiven; 2)
determine to be a man of faith and not of doubt (Jas.1:6); 3) double
down on your commitment to spiritual growth. If you do these things, the
trials you are going through can not only be a time of special closeness
to the Lord but one of great spiritual victory as well.
Do feel free to write me back about this (keep in mind that tomorrow is
posting day and that it may be Sunday late before I can reply).
Keeping you in my prayers for all these things, my friend.
In Jesus,
Bob L.