Question #1:

Hello Dr. Luginbill,

I have been asked this question from this particular person any number of time, but he keeps coming back from time to time. About 43 years ago, when I was first born-again, he asked me the same question, "can you commit suicide and still be saved?" – because he was thinking about doing so. My answer was the same then as it is now, no.

His problem is that he has monthly visits with a psychologist; instead of depending upon God. I just received this email this morning and wanted to forward it to you, to see the what I believe is in agreement with scripture. You know what my answer would be, faith is the requirement for gaining entrance to heaven. Eph.2:8-9; Prov.3:5-6.

The reason he is in the spiritual shape he is in is, he does not study the Word and apply it to his life. He is a multi-millionaire, but won't ever admit that to me; he has accumulated a mound of gold and silver stored in multiple safe deposits at several banks, and some buried in his back yard. In my opinion, because of what he has made his treasure to be, has caused him to become cold in heart, and does not even recognize that he is cold. Asking for your scriptural opinion on what he has written below:

Brother,
We need to talk a little bit more about a genuine, pure, born again Christian and if such a person is capable of committing suicide and going to heaven.

Fundamentally, I believe the answer is a resounding YES, even there are no specific scriptures citing a clear YES. There are some sound scriptures that support a definitive YES answer. Lets discuss it sometime. I think we both have the same understanding and definition of what FAITH is, what a believer is and what sins are.

Here are a few questions with thoughts that support a yes answer:

1. Can a believer (born again) knowingly commit a premeditated and planned sin? Such as adultery or lying or stealing a fountain pen from their work place?
2. Do sins keep us out of heaven or is it a lack of faith?
3. Do sins cause us to go to hell, or is it a lack of faith?
4. Is faith (with a few good works here and there) the one and only requirement for going to heaven?
5. What sins are there that would keep anyone out of heaven?
6. Is a believer who has severe mental illness responsible to God for intentionally committing suicide with full knowledge of it being sinful, are they forgiven, even though they do not have opportunity for repentance after their sin? Is there room for God's mercy to be fulfilled for such a sinner who doesn't and can't repent?
7. What happens if such a person is not as severely mentally ill and commits suicide?
8. Is a believer who attends church occasionally, does a few works here and there, lives by the worldly standards some of the time, repents perhaps once a week, reads the word on Sundays for a few minutes, pays his taxes and tithes out of a sense of duty, and is a general good citizen, e.g. does not rob others, does not rape or kill anyone and obeys all the civil laws; are they really a believer and would they go to heaven upon committing suicide?

Some of the question are readily answered, so I don't know why he is even asking them.

I really think that if I give him concurrence with what he is contemplating, that is what he wants, acknowledgment from me, but he will not receive it from me, but I will never concur with suicide as his answer.

My opinion, you lose faith in Jesus Christ, you lose heaven, period; and he is treading on dangerous ground at the moment.

This is the very person that told me about Jesus Christ and salvation, and the one who taught me for a while. So sad.....Again, this is another one of those doozies that come my way, I suppose from the LORD??? I have acquired two more pupils that the LORD provided, to teach on Sunday every week. I am thankful for that.

Thanks always for your great help.

Response #1: 

It's good of you to "hang in there" with such individuals, my friend. I am sure that all of your counsel to him has been first rate.

You acquaintance starts by asking "[if] a genuine, pure, born again Christian . . . person is capable of committing suicide and going to heaven". My response would be, "why in the world would a "genuine, pure, born again Christian" ever even want to contemplate such a thing? In terms of Christians, in my humble opinion, you'd have to pretty close to apostasy, have zero fear of God left, be so narcissistically focused on self to the exclusion of all else to do that, that, if done, I would be unsure whether such a person was saved when they did it. Mind you, only God knows, but that is no reason to play Russian roulette . . . with only one chamber POSSIBLY empty.

You are also right as a pastor-teacher to avoid approaching "questions" as if they were only "questions". Our Lord always answered according to the genuine motivations that lay behind them, and we are responsible to attempt to do the same to the best of our wisdom and ability – especially since often people are looking to use our answers as excuses to do stupid things, to do what they really WANT to do as opposed to what Christ wants them to do.

You are also right on the money in discerning that a person has to be far from the Lord and not moving forward spiritually to go down the road of fixating on something like this. What said person (or anyone who is contemplating any sinful, evil, illegal or self-destructive activity) needs is to turn back to the Lord just like the prodigal son did . . . and then begin the process of spiritual growth through attention to the truth of scripture and a good teaching ministry. That can't all be solved in a single email, no matter how "good" it is.

Here are some links on this issue:

Funeral for an unbeliever

The death of Saul

Suicide in Proverbs?

Suicide, Good Works, and Salvation

Resisting the Devil

Congrats on your expanding ministry! I have been praying for that.

In Jesus,

Bob L.

Question #2:  

Read my last email that started this thread please. Is "godly sorrow" a part of repentance to be saved, and how do we attain it?

I just learned from your site that believing in Jesus is more than just trusting in Him, without commitment to following Him...it actually requires that you stop wanting this empty life, and become dedicated to Christ...I doubt this is even possible for me. I realize now that I never truly wanted to follow God like He needs for salvation. I'm sorry Doc...I don't think I CAN be saved in my state, not having the emotion to care about anything but what makes me feel good in the moment.

I'm sorry if it turns out the idea of brain and soul being connected is occultic. I'm not sure if it is, but I expect that will be your answer...and also, I truly believe myself to be apostate...I do believe in and trust Jesus for salvation...but as of recently...I know it's just in my head...but I started giving in to the temptation to do the divining....in the name of the devil.

I'll get a knife or gun and see myself off to Hell if I'm truly apostate. If everything truly is at least partially our fault, it's my fault this happened fully. It doesn't matter that i couldn't fully convince myself that it's still witchcraft even though I only do it in my head, and that doing something "in the name of" something is glorifying or at least honoring it...I can't live this down even if I somehow am forgiven for this. I'm sorry Doc...I know you might never forgive me, and that's ok. Please tell me there's still hope for me to stop and be forgiven by God.

Doc, one more thing today if you have time? There is proof that people with schizophrenia for example, have very different brain patterns, even a lack of brain matter in some places, compared to people who don't. I'm not saying all "mental illness" is legitimate, multiple personalities for example is almost certainly completely fake, but surely you wouldn't say the brain and spirit aren't connected at all.

Unless you're going to claim people born mentally defunct Don't have a spirit?
Or even that people who gen in an accident and become that way lose it!?

Response #2: 

Our God is a forgiving God. He sent His Son to die for our sins, after all. Why would He do that if He didn't want us to be saved (1Tim.2:4)? None of us is any better or any worse inherently – we all need God's grace in Jesus Christ, and we all have it abundantly, if we just are willing to respond to the Lord objectively (rather than focusing exclusively on ourselves subjectively).

The LORD is merciful and gracious,
Slow to anger, and abounding in mercy.
He will not always strive with us,
Nor will He keep His anger forever.
He has not dealt with us according to our sins,
Nor punished us according to our iniquities.
For as the heavens are high above the earth,
So great is His mercy toward those who fear Him;
As far as the east is from the west,
So far has He removed our transgressions from us.
As a father pities his children,
So the LORD pities those who fear Him.
Psalm 103:8-13 NKJV

So trust in Him, confess when you do sin (1Jn.1:9), and get back on the track of picking up your cross and following Jesus Christ.

Of course, "belief" is not mere mental understanding of existence:

You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe—and tremble!
James 2:19 NKJV

On the other hand, belief is not something impossible to understand or to attain either:

But the righteousness of faith speaks in this way, “Do not say in your heart, ‘Who will ascend into heaven?’ ” (that is, to bring Christ down from above) or, “ ‘Who will descend into the abyss?’ ” (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead). But what does it say? “The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart” (that is, the word of faith which we preach): that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.
Romans 10:6-9 NKJV

We know what it is to trust in the Lord and what it is not to do so. And we have the Spirit within us making it clear, if we are willing to listen. So don't get hung up on the small stuff. You know what it is to follow Christ and you know what it is not to follow Christ. This is a question of free will.

There are of course limits. If a person has their brain severely damaged in an accident they might no longer be able to use their free will (even if technically alive on life support). But the exceptions prove the rule. The fact that the rest of us have bad tendencies or self-inflicted patterns of behavior does not excuse our decisions – we are responsible for what we think, say and do. Better not to worry about mitigating factors. Better to do what you can to start going the right way and keep at it.

If you want to know what true biblical repentance is, please read this link: "Repentance, Confession, and Forgiveness" (in BB 3B).

Please remember, believers are saved; unbelievers are not saved (Jn.3:18). So put your faith in Christ if you are not saved; if you are already a believer (as I know you are), resolve to stop wasting your life. Anything positive you do for the Lord, including spiritual growth and advance, will be rewarded (link); everything else in this life, unless it is a necessity, is essentially a waste.

In Jesus,

Bob L.

Question #3:  

I'm determined to believe in Jesus until the day I die or until He returns...does this mean I'm saved? I never want to not truly believe in Him, in His entire work and person, and I never want to not trust Him for my salvation...is this enough? Just need to be sure...and how do I stop this vile sin of mine? How do I stop wanting it in my heart?

Response #3: 

Sounds like the very definition of a believer to me.

As to "enough?", we trust Jesus for salvation, meaning that we are following Him through this world to the place of glory. But we do have to keep following Him, keep trusting Him, keep believing in Him. That following affects ever bit of our lives – or at least it should.

As to "how?", if you are reading a study in Ichthys, you are not at the same time doing vile things; if you are praying, you are not at the same time doing vile things; if you are reading your Bible, you are not at the same time doing vile things. If you are working for a living or working out for your health or helping someone in the Name of Christ, you are not at the same time doing vile things. So if you are doing good things, you are not at the same time doing vile things. My advice therefore: do good things so that you will not at the same time be doing vile things.

(16) But I tell you, walk in the Spirit and you will not carry out what the flesh lusts for. (17) For what the flesh lusts for is contrary to the Spirit's will, and the Spirit is opposed to what the flesh lusts for. Since these are diametrically opposed to each other in this way, what you are doing is not what you yourself choose. (18) But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the Law. (19) The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; (20) idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions and envy; (21) drunkenness, orgies – and whatever is similar to all these things. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of heaven. (22) But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, uprightness, faith, (23) humility, self-control. Against such things, there is no Law. (24) Now those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its weaknesses and its lusts. (25) If we live because of the Spirit, let us also walk by means of the Spirit.
Galatians 5:16-25

The same goes for speaking and also for thinking:

(1) Therefore since you have been resurrected [positionally] with Christ, keep seeking after the things above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God. (2) Keep thinking on the things above, and not the things on the earth.
Colossians 3:1-2

Finally, brothers, whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable – if anything is excellent or praiseworthy – think about such things.
Philippians 4:8 NIV

Here's a link which will lead to more:  Sin, Guilt, and Salvation VII

In Jesus,

Bob L.

Question #4:  

I'll give you answer my questions in my other mails...but I have something to tell you...I'm seeking mental help-PROPER mental help, from an actual therapist. At this point, where I'm deluded into thinking there's no way Jesus is even Lord and it might even be ok to praise the devil half the time, then suddenly switching back to struggling to believe in Jesus and reject everything to do with the occult, and back-I don't care what you say about "free will", this isn't entirely me doing it. Surely you can agree that insanity is an actual thing right? At this point I think I might actually be starting to go insane. I'm seeking help, and you can't stop me. I've suffered long enough. "But God will help you-" not while I'm like this, according to your doctrine, unless I'm getting something wrong.

When it literally gets to the point where you know the devil is the cause of all the suffering in the world, and God is the cause of all good, yet legitimately can't convince yourself that the devil is evil and God is good, that's a call for immediate mental help. I will be reading Ichthys and the Bible regularly, but I also need actual help from a professional if I'm going to get out of this. Now, I will do my best to trust God (the God of the Bible, not the devil who I'm sometimes deluded into thinking might be God) that He will deliver me, partially through the therapist or whatever. Please keep praying for me too.

Goodbye for now, Doc. I hope you can accept what I'm doing...

Can't believe I forgot this one, read my last 2 emails please, they're short. If I sometimes doubt God's righteousness and even holiness when in great mental and spiritual duress, does that mean I'm not saved? I always realize I'm wrong sooner rather than later.

One more question i have: I take it that when Jesus told Thomas that those who believe without seeing are blessed, that applies to all manner of spiritual truth, that if we have Faith in any truth with just some evidence and not all there is to know, God will bless us for that?

A couple questions for tomorrow, since I know you probably won't have anymore to for me today: How do I bring myself to true repentance and confession? And is Yahweh the name of God the Father, or the entire triune God? Is that even His true name?

Response #4: 

No offense taken. Please do what you need to do for the sake of your health:

1) I would NEVER tell someone NOT to get professional help if they need it.

2) I have ALWAYS affirmed that I have known people who have benefitted from such help.

*3) It's certainly better to get such help than to do something you would regret.

4) My position is that when it comes to our hearts and minds, spiritual help is vastly superior in every imaginable way to any secular help, therapy, medication, etc.

5) However, many people for various reasons are not really willing to accept God's help, the help of the Spirit, the help of the Word. That does take time and effort and consistency and genuine commitment of a spiritual nature. Most people are not even willing to accept salvation, God's free gift, so I suppose this is not surprising either. So for those who fall into this category, namely, of not being willing to do what is necessary to be helped by the Lord, secular "professional" help is recommended (as opposed to doing themselves harm, for sure).

I will continue to pray for you.

In Jesus,

Bob L.

Question #5:  

Thank you Doc. I can't tell you how glad I am it turned out you're one of the few good teachers I've met. Most I've followed were just bullies, well intentioned as they were, using Scripture as an excuse for their abuses. I'm sorry I assumed the worst of you, I was just scared you would turn out to be the same after so long, like almost all teachers I've followed. I've followed many, many well-intentioned false teachers, who turned out to be very wrong on key issues, and even unintentionally abused their following in the name of their theology. Here's some I can remember, not in chronological order:

Various Messianic teachers
Taught that we must keep all of the Mosaic Law to be saved, were generally legitimately humble, but that only increased their zeal for their false teaching.

The Church of Christ cult
I was obsessed with a website called Bible.ca that taught tons of very convincing false doctrine. It turned out this whole thing was promoting an abusive cult called the Church of Christ. I even physically attended one of their churches for some time.

The Living Church of God cult
An Armstrongian cult that offshoots from the Worldwide Church of God cult. They taught going to the doctor is having "little faith in God", leading hundreds of their members to unnecessarily die over the years. Also teaches extreme works salvation.

David J Stewart
Runs a website called Jesusissavior.com, which spouts all sorts of extreme fear mongering conspiracy theories, as well as an extreme version of once saved always saved.

I'm glad I've finally settled on a good ministry like Ichthys. Please pray for the people who follow these false teachers and ministries.

Why do you say fantasy and sci-fi are so bad? Now, I know for me it should be avoided, since I actually struggle with temptations of the occult, but most fantasy stuff doesn't resemble the occult as far as I can tell, and I think if someone is strong (mature) enough of a believer to accurately discern good and bad, it shouldn't be a problem.

Doc...you don't need to answer my last email. I'm not sure if I believe in Jesus anymore...I WANT to deep down, and that's why I never stay in my delusions for long...I'm scared of going to Hell...must I truly give up everything to be saved? If I was saved, I'm sure I'm apostate at this point...I'm scared most of all because I feel like I'm losing even that will to believe in Him. It's all my fault I'm like this...I'm sorry. It's all because I kept trying to redeem my favorite activities and entertainments while I was in such a dire state. Now I can barely do anything I enjoy without getting the Strong urge to...praise the devil for it. I've been playing and watching things less and less though because I feel like an actual monster for insulting Christ in such a way while doing it, giving in to some of my most vile temptations while doing it...it's almost escaped my head at this point, and I feel like even more of one when I try to return to it without doing such things, most of all when I try to do it to God's glory only to regress back into such things...I need some time to think...I'm sorry I didn't focus on Bible study and prayer and all that. If I truly wanted to change, I would have...but I've realized now this unholy beast is just who I am, possibly possibly who I want to be, and I couldn't be more ashamed...no amount of apology or even sorrow can make up for any of this. If I'm condemned to Hell, unable to repent...it'll only serve me right....there's but one hope. How do I bring myself to godly contrition for sin, the kind that leads to true confession? And what kind of dedication is needed to Christ to be saved?

Response #5: 

First, thank you for the good words, and also for your enlightening testimony. I'm sure this will be helpful to others. That is ministry too - on your part.

Second, I don't ever recall saying that "fantasy and sci-fi are so bad". What I probably did say is that 1) it is a mistake to take any work of fiction seriously, and that making decisions of any kind based upon "what is likely to happen" when one's basis for making such assumptions is entirely based upon fictional representations (rather than the reality of life experience) is a truly bad idea; and 2) that in a perfect application we would use all of our time and effort to serve the Lord. The latter is aspirational. None of us is perfect – certainly not myself.

I have remarked in the past that in terms of what we find in scripture the apostle Paul probably came the closest to a "total effort" for the Lord. As he himself says, he worked "much harder" than the other apostles – and yet the other eleven also have their names emblazoned on one of the foundation stones of New Jerusalem just as he does. So between doing nothing (and only unbelievers do nothing: Jas.2:17; 2:20; 2:26) and between doing everything (and only our Lord managed that) there is a WIDE spectrum of possibilities. In my estimation from my study of scripture, most believers will have precious little to place before the Lord on that day of evaluation, but they will still be saved. Salvation is based upon believing in Jesus Christ; what we do in response to our faith in Him after we are saved is the basis for our eternal rewards, not for any determination of salvation.

This is issue is important. If we are not moving forward, then it's highly likely that we are moving backward, and faith is thus either growing or decaying, even if very slowly. And faith can die. If a person stops believing in Christ – and that is a decision just as believing in Christ is a decision – then there will be no rewards because that person no longer belongs to Him.

So by all means, we all ought to let go of the bad past and determine instead to get moving forward spiritually (Phil.3:12-16), both for our eternal security and also because we surely ought to want to be highly rather than minimally rewarded by our Lord, winning a "well done" instead of a bonfire (even if saved nonetheless: 1Cor.3:11-15). Therefore the more we dedicate ourselves to spiritual growth, progress and production, the better for us in every way.

But it is a mistake to see this as all or nothing – because no one could be "all". It's just that by not striving for what we have been called to strive for, "next to nothing" might be the best possible outcome we can hope for. And why settle for that?

So on the one hand, please don't neurose over salvation since you know you do believe in Jesus Christ; and on the other hand, please don't think that it doesn't make any difference how you use your time: every decision we make down here is important.

"Peace I leave with you, My peace I give to you; not as the world gives do I give to you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid."
John 14:27 NKJV

Christ called us to peace. We have a right NOT to be constantly upset and on "pins and needles" about our salvation. That is absolutely secure . . . so long as we maintain our faith in Him. And that best way to do that is also the best way to glorify Him and bless ourselves for all eternity: spiritual growth, progress and production. Q.E.D.

In Jesus,

Bob L.

Question #6:  

Thank you Doc...I'm definitely getting cognitive behavioral therapy for my compulsions to do evil things...I have a hard time discerning fiction and reality as of now, with how badly I am mentally, so couples with the vile whispers of lies (more like them screaming in my hear at the top of their lungs at this point) from the enemy, that's probably why I'm having faith issues...or maybe I'm just THAT addicted to such evil? Why must these things make me feel good...I don't want them to be good, they only brutalize and maul my faith.

Sometimes when I'm caught up in trying to enjoy life (as in a very unhealthy level of indulgence of this world), I just wish both God and the devil would just disappear. I know it's wrong to feel that way though, for the devil it makes sense, all he does is cause suffering, but why would I want God to go away? I always remember how without God, there would be no standard of good, so it would be perfectly ok for anyone to do whatever they please, even the very worst people. I also remember that these things never give me any true happiness, the pleasure they give is fleeting, and they will ultimately be no more once everything is said and done. God gives true joy and peace, something I want yet don't seem to be motivated to pursue...

Response #6: 

"I also remember that these things never give me any true happiness" Good! That puts you ahead of 99.999% of the rest of the world (link).

You are figuring this out. Good for you! Keep fighting. This sort of fight isn't won in a single day. But you can win it. You have the Holy Spirit. Start relying on Him more and on yourself less.

In terms of dedication, best practice is to set yourself to do what you reasonably and consistently can where you are at now in your spiritual status – and try to expand that day by day. It's a mistake either to 1) try to get by with doing as little as possible (because that approach can endanger your faith) or 2) try to do everything perfectly at once – not even Paul was perfect, and he didn't get to his near-perfect application overnight or with no effort.

You know what it good to do: pray, Bible, Bible study, walk with your eyes on the Lord – more is better than less; move forwards, not backwards.

In Jesus,

Bob L.

Question #7:  

I have a life question I am really hoping you can help me with. I don't have any other way to learn this. Could you please bear with me, and help me? Because it is about daily life which cross-sections living in faith.

1) The easiest way is to give a concrete example. My former-teacher-who-is-now-an-engineer and I were walking around her neighborhood. And she was mentioning some shoddy work done by construction workers (that the way they did it meant it would last 10 years not 20). And my first reaction was to almost shrug that off, and I know she did not like that. But I know as a worker on the bottom, we have to do what the people above us say. (I was thinking it may have been a situation similar to what I have been in). At my job I have done lots of inefficient and useless things that they wanted, (that wastes company time at least) and put on a false face (because that is what they want). Am I misguided or wrong? If we don't put on this face and just obey we will end up let go. But would it be any different at any other job?

2) Secondly, that coworker is doing the baby shower next month. I messed up the date and drove over an hour there and then over an hour back, and decided I will just give her the gift when she comes by the office. Part of putting on a false face is pretending to be best buds FOREVER!!! until they leave and we never speak their name again. Like they never existed.

Is it bad for me to pretend, though I feel like I have to? Is it the Christian duty to have charity towards a pregnant coworker? I hate having to pretend like this, and I feel like because I am pretending I don't get spiritual credit. In my mind I don't know if this coworker is deluded that we all really care (because as I say I have seen MANY coworkers come and go whom no one mentions their name again, who we did the parties for), or maybe she is knowingly exploitative of the situation (knows we have to attend and put on a face and buy her gifts or we get in trouble), or am I deluded and like a psychopath for not caring?

My dear friend, thanks for being patient with me and helping me. If you could give me any guidance I would really appreciate it.

I think I also was wondering if I was living in sin with this constant pretending (it feels like lying), and doing the other not-so-moral things I mentioned (like not the best work), but I feel it is all I can do. Do you think most workplaces are like what I described? If so we are all stuck doing it right?

How are you doing?

Response #7: 

It would be impossible to find a perfect workplace because no person is perfect. In this day and age, finding a moderately good one is a victory. Even at places like my university that like to put on a face of ethical behavior and care and concern for their workers, the truth is otherwise. If I adopted the course of action you are worried you ought to take I'd certainly have to quit . . . and would be hard pressed to find a school that wasn't like this (even if they were willing to hire me at this point). Why? Because people are people and the people in any country/culture reflect the overall values of that country/culture generally, with believers being the rare exceptions when the values are bad (along with the occasional exceptional, moral unbeliever as well). In short, I think you'd have to leave and go to some other place that doesn't exist to avoid this sort of problem. In scripture, we are responsible to do a good job as unto the Lord. As long as they are not illegal or anything like that, if you are faithfully carrying out the orders of your superiors, even if they are stupid, that is honoring to the Lord. After all, "stupid" is not a crime. If it were, we'd have to build a lot more jails.

As to responsibilities to co-workers, I'm terribly sorry that you wasted your time like that. Maybe there is a lesson there. Is someone is genuinely my friend, I will socialize with them. But I resist socializing with co-workers, even though I realize that there is a price to pay for not doing so. For me, at this point in my career, that price is minimal, so we do have to "count the cost" for anything we do or fail to do. It's no crime to go to a party for work, and it's no sin either. You have to be able to live with yourself. If not going is going to bother you more than going, then think about going – and vice versa. There's no blanket Bible answer here because this depends on knowing yourself and what you resolve to do or don't do. I'll say a prayer for you on this.

I'm doing pretty well. It's going to be a busy one here with final prep for the new semester one week out. Hope your week goes well too.

In Jesus,

Bob L.

Question #8:  

I basically have great social struggles, struggling to understand social cues or what people mean emotionally. Being online without any vocal or facial emotion in text only makes this worse. I tend to worry about doing or saying something wrong...then failing to realize what I end up doing is considered weird or otherwise abnormal when I finally decide to say something. Please pray for me in this regard, I've decided to try my best, with God's help if He's willing, to learn to properly socialize and whatnot, not just for everyday means but to be better as a Christian in this regard.

Response #8: 

I believe that social media and the internet, complicated by the Covid shutdowns, have damaged many young people at a critical time.

However, socializing is overrated because we socialize with people, and as Christians we know what is truly "in" people (Jer.17:9; cf. Jn.2:25).

That said, we all do need some contact with people – in person, not online. For all good Christians who are trusting in the Lord and spiritually advancing, our God answers our prayers and satisfies all of our needs. So persevere in your spiritual advance, put your petitions before the Lord, and He will give you the desires of your heart (Ps.37:4).

But let patience have its perfect work, that you may be perfect and complete, lacking nothing. If any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives to all liberally and without reproach, and it will be given to him. But let him ask in faith, with no doubting, for he who doubts is like a wave of the sea driven and tossed by the wind. For let not that man suppose that he will receive anything from the Lord; he is a double-minded man, unstable in all his ways.
James 1:4-8 NKJV

In Jesus,

Bob L.

Question #9:  

Please pray that God would save me I'm 64 and I'm scared I never been obedient to God I want to now but God won't hear me please I'm so scared.

Response #9: 

God hears you. He hears us all.  He is God.  And He is merciful. All who believe are saved; only those who are not should be scared:

'"He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God."
'John 3:18 NKJV

If you are concerned, please say a prayer of confession to the Lord, and you WILL be forgiven all of your sins (Ps.32:5; 103:3; Matt.6:12; 1Jn.1:9). Never underestimate God's mercy:

'The LORD is compassionate and gracious, slow to anger, abounding in love. He will not always accuse, nor will he harbor his anger forever; he does not treat us as our sins deserve or repay us according to our iniquities. For as high as the heavens are above the earth, so great is his love for those who fear him; as far as the east is from the west, so far has he removed our transgressions from us. As a father has compassion on his children, so the LORD has compassion on those who fear him.
'Psalm 103:8-13 NIV

I am praying for your daily, my friend.

In Jesus,

Bob L.

Question #10:  

Would you pray that God would take away my frightenedness. I have it all day fore the past 7years or more.

Response #10:

I'm praying for you daily.

If you start reading the materials at Ichthys with regularity, I am sure that will help.

The Peter series (link) is a good place to start.

In Jesus,

Bob L.

Question #11:  

Doc, what's the "Session of Christ" and why is it so important to salvation?

Also is it really bad to celebrate Christmas with presents? I mean, the Bible does say we shouldn't make any day more important than another if i remember correctly, we aren't in the Old Testament anymore where there were all these special feast days after all, but in all honesty, i don't see why it would be bad to use the opportunity to give some gifts to friends and family.

Sorry, I tend to forget what you've already said if it was even a little while back for some reason...re-read your answer to my previous Christmas question, and it answered the last email nicely. I have another question though: How do I recognize when suffering is testing from God, when it's my fault from my sin, or unjust entirely by others?

Response #11: 

Christ's session was the official acknowledgment by the Father of the successful completion of the mission of salvation (see the link).

On how to evaluate suffering, the closer we are walking to the Lord, the less we will need to wonder whether or not "we deserve it". So another good reason to stay frosty on defense (avoiding all serious sinning) and to keep up the positive forward progress in spiritual growth.

When it comes to discipline, moreover, if we make a habit of repentance and confession whenever we DO stumble, then it doesn't really matter the cause of suffering since from the point of our confession we are forgiven so that all we suffer is for our good and our blessing thereafter. The question thus becomes a bit academic, but even here we get better at evaluating ourselves and thus better at answering this question for ourselves the more we grow.

See the link:  "The Fact and Purpose of Divine Discipline" (in BB 3B)

Wishing you a nice run up to Christmas.

In Jesus,

Bob L.

Question #12:  

Hi Bob,

Thank You so much for sharing. Congratulations to you. God bless you, your family, and your ministry.

You have been a blessing to us.

Response #12: 

My pleasure – thanks for the good words!

Keeping you and your son in my prayers.

In Jesus,

Bob L.

Question #13:  

Hi Bob,

I am presently examining the concepts of testing and temptation, and have a couple questions:

1) In Matthew 4:5-7, the devil takes Jesus up to the top of the temple in Jerusalem.

I came across an interpretation that inferred that there would have been a crowd present, an "audience." So, the thinking would go, this was really about Satan telling Jesus to "show off" -- to launch himself off the temple, be saved by God, and then have the people marvel at this public display. And that this would be part of the "temptation."

Up until now, I'd never given much thought to the idea of others being present during these temptation of Christ proceedings. I think I'm a bit skeptical because the text never mentions a crowd, but on the other hand, well, the temple is in the city, and unless it was the middle of the night or something, people likely would be about.

Would they have been able to see them from the street/be aware of their presence, do you think? Would it have been supernaturally prevented by God or or even Satan?

Thoughts on the line of thought mentioned re: showing off to the audience being part of the temptation?

2) I'm trying to wrap my head better around what exactly "testing God" means. If Jesus says we shouldn't do it in Matthew 4:7, well, what exactly is it?

Is it something like "placing requirements/demands upon the Lord that are not consistent with His Will?"

Here in Matthew 4, Jesus would run afoul of this if He demanded God save Him supernaturally from falling from a great height. Other passages that seem relevant:

The Israelites at Massah in Exodus 17:1ff. (cf. how it is referenced in Psalm 95:8, Deuteronomy 6:16)
The punishment by serpents in Numbers 21:4ff. (cf. how it is referenced in 1 Corinthians 10:9)
The Israelites generally in the forty years in the wilderness (Hebrews 3:7-11). Also, cf. Number 14:20ff
Ananias and Sapphira in Acts 5:1ff.
Acts 15:10
Lots of other references too in the Psalms etc.: https://bible.knowing-jesus.com/topics/Testing-God

I guess why I'm trying to pin down exactly what "testing God" means is because in popular consciousness people seem to make it just about not asking for "signs from God" and the like. Something along the lines of "If I flip this coin and it is heads, I'll date him, if not, I won't. God, tell me what I should do -- it's in your hands!"

God doesn't want us to make decisions by coinflip, but by reading and studying His Word, and listening to the still, small voice of the Spirit that operates on that truth we have learned, believed, and applied in our lives.

But, in any case, I don't think testing God is just refraining from asking for signs. How do all the passages make sense then?

Basically, if it's not as simple as that, then what is the best way of explaining the concept?

3) Everything gets even murkier when one considers that sometimes asking for signs is not even a bad thing, but a good thing. Cf. Ahaz's refusal to do so in Isaiah 7 being described as trying God's patience. Also, Gideaon asking for signs comes to mind too.

You can compare what you've already written in this email response, Q/A #19.

So how does this new observation of "well, it depends" interact with trying to define what testing God means? (As in, the thrust of question 2 above)?

Not calling contradiction here or anything, just trying to figure out how to best explain the concept.

Hopefully all the questions are clear, but let me know if not.

Your friend in Jesus,

Response #13: 

1) I share your skepticism. Lots of reasons why this might not have been seen (i.e., the back not the front of the temple where the courts were; the fact that this was all supernaturally occurring – no one saw the devil, I'm sure); but no compelling reason to think otherwise and the Bible says nothing about anyone watching.

2) 1st Corinthians 10:9 in its context provides a good clue. In that context (1Cor.10:1-13), Paul describes the exodus generation as a negative example, an example of how NOT to behave. Verse nine is merely one of four incidents mentioned – and of course the Lord had said that this generation "disobeyed me and tested me ten times". From which I get that testing God is disobedience to Him and vice versa, and also that all of these things in 1Cor.10:1-13 amount to testing God. So any time we disobey Him, any time we sin, we are testing Him, that is, foolishly pushing the limits – just as children do with their parents. Of course, obviously, some such behavior is far worse than other manifestations of it, and chronic bad behavior is worse than an occasional stumble. But just as with our parents, that authority line is something we need to learn to respect.

3) I wouldn't worry too much about popular misconceptions unless you're forced to confront them. Otherwise, you'd probably have little time for anything else! Clearly, asking for a sign when God has already made something clear is a mistake. Circumstances are important here. God did not blast Gideon, although any believer reading about the fleece would be embarrassed for him, I think. Our Lord's generation asked for signs in the presence of the One who had raised the dead and restored sight to the blind (e.g.). At some point, such "asking" is disingenuous. But sometimes people need such things. Look what the Lord did for Moses in giving him signs to do (Ex.4:1-9). So if the Lord tells you to ask for a sign (as with Hezekiah and as with Ahaz), refusing really is "putting God to the test".

Glad you got back safe and sound.

In Jesus,

Bob L.

Question #14:  

I was reading this part: "For example, Adam and Eve became mortal, were cursed, and were expelled from paradise for eating of the forbidden fruit, an act which does not seem particularly immoral, sinful, bad, or evil in and of itself, but which was a clear and willful rejection of God's authority," and one thing I have thought of is that the act of sin, regardless of whether it is small or large (whether in our eyes or the Lord's if there is such a thing as a small sin to Him)-the act itself of treating God like that....the God who gave us all good things, and sustains us, and we could writes books upon books of His goodness...that treating Him like that in and of itself is evil. And this is before you get to the issue of rejecting Him and His authority. Which is like the limb cutting itself off from the base of the tree.

Sort of like the idea in, if you have parents that always loved and took care of and helped you, and then you do something bad against them even if it seems small, maybe we get more of a sense of how the fact of the act itself has its own depth of evil/badness.

Or maybe I am overthinking lol

But please do tell me how you are?

Response #14: 

It is true that sin is an act of rebellion against God.

Whoever commits sin also commits lawlessness, and sin is lawlessness.
1st John 3:4 NKJV

That said, there is no believer who does not sin and there is therefore no believer who does not have to confess, and saying (or thinking) differently is calling God a liar.

If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.
1st John 1:8-10 NKJV

So it is a blessed thing that Christ died for all our sins – and that He is our Advocate when we do sin.

My little children, these things I write to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world.
1st John 2:1-2 NKJV

Doing well - glad tomorrow is Friday. Hope the week as gone well for you too!

In Jesus,

Bob L.

Question #15:  

Doctor L.

Greetings in the Lord.

I have read through your general ideas behind the False Doctrine of Absolute Eternal Security. While I generally agree with your conclusions and agree with not being on pins and needles salvation, there are a couple of conclusions you reached which I would counsel revisiting.

First, God does discipline us. But the discipline of God is not always effective. We see evidence of this in Amos 4 for example where God’s repeated attempts to discipline his elect was ineffective. I think God describes 5 different types of discipline each time resulting in “yet you have not returned to me” Furthermore, why would God not discipline us when we are falling away if its always effective? We also see in the NT, God did not choose to discipline Ananias and Sapphira but killed them outright. I understand you believe God is able to discipline in a manner that gets people’s attention and in general agree as there are many places in scripture where this is demonstrated but it is a mistake to assume that all will respond equally to the lash. In the end, God destroyed 90% of the 10 tribes and most of the 2 remaining ones. If God’s discipline is always effective why did they need to be destroyed, especially His Treasured Possession? The answer is clear: God tried to discipline them but it was not effective. Finally, there are plenty in scripture that God did not discipline; He just punished or killed.

Second, I understand as you do that if we sin, seek forgiveness and earnestly turn back to God we will be forgiven. Yet the history of God shows that He does not suffer ongoing rebellion. Paraphrasing Oscar Wilde if I may “To sin once may be regarded a misfortune. To continue in sin, smacks of disregard.” The point is that there is no doubt that loss of faith will lead to loss of salvation, but the essence of refusing to live as the Spirit leads us, is also loss of faith (or a dying faith). A slowly hardening heart is just as spiritually damaging in the end as is outright repentance away from God. We are taught throughout scripture what a true faith looks like and what it produces. You may have noticed, save for the thief on the cross who did all he could, every determination of where men spend eternity is based on works, not faith. Let me know if you want the list. This is also the reason we are warned three times in the NT about the Israelites and their behavior who demonstrated their evolving unbelief through their actions.

We retain our ability to choose whether to follow God or not after we come to Him. Praise the Lord that we have the Holy Spirit to guide us but as you know, we can grieve or quench the Holy Spirit rejecting where He leads.

All His Best.

Response #15: 

Good to make your acquaintance.

As to "there are a couple of conclusions you reached which I would counsel revisiting", it's not clear from your email what these might be. In terms of the gist of the article to which you refer there seems to be no substantive disagreement on any major point. Here are some comments on other things you raise:

You wrote, "God tried to discipline them but it was not effective". There is a difference between how God comports Himself towards individual believers on the one hand, and towards nations – especially towards Israel as a nation – on the other. There is such a thing as blessing by association (the salt principle); there is also such a thing as cursing by association. Jeremiah was a great believer and so was his associate Baruch, but their lives were greatly impacted by the fact they belonged to a sinful nation at that point (cf. esp. Jer.45:1-5). What they personally suffered was most assuredly not divine discipline.

Also important to note is that divine discipline is technically something which the Lord reserves for His true sons and daughters, that is to say, for believers (Heb.12:3-11). Unbelievers are not judged by the same standard nor are they treated the same way He treats us. Each time the Jewish nation was severely punished or ejected from the land, the reason was not so much that the believers therein were misbehaving but rather that the people therein were not believers at all. They were following the Baals and/or involved in other activities not as believers for the most part but as those who had never put their faith in the Lord as their original forefather Abraham had done (Gen.15:6, e.g.).

Also important to note is that the "ten tribes" were never completely destroyed. There are representatives from all 12/13 tribes who survived in antiquity and whose offspring are still alive today (here's a link which lead you to others: "Lost Tribes").

Finally, when you talk about God "trying" but being "ineffective", it is good to remember just how wise and powerful our God is. He created the universe through Jesus Christ in the blink of an eye and exists in glory outside of time and space. He foreordained the entirety of history – the history of the universe and that of His creatures – in absolute precision covering every event down to the subatomic level before He initiated creation. He not only knows everything that would happen – nothing could ever happen unless it was part of the perfectly ordained all-encompassing plan He ordained before time began. Nothing is an accident. Everything He does / has planned is perfect (even if from our very limited human perspective we fail to see it sometimes).

We do indeed have free will. But we could not have it, we could not be free to choose, unless God had ordained that ability and integrated all those choices into the one perfect plan from the beginning. So it is not as if God is "surprised" by any event or any human reaction. He never "tries" to do things. Instead He is working "all things together for the for those who have been called according to [that perfect] plan" (Rom.8:28).

In short, I think you have misread this article somewhat or at the very least not understood some of its points because you are not familiar with the teachings of this ministry overall. That is certainly understandable since you are coming to it for the first time. It would take you several years, I would imagine, to come close to reading everything that has been posted over a lifetime of working on Ichthys, let alone to digest it.

So as long as we are making suggestions, I would suggest that you read Bible Basics 3B: Hamartiology: the Biblical Study of Sin (at the link). The Peter series, from which the article you cite comes, is very basic (especially in the early going where you are at present) and so is generally the one I send people to first when they are just beginning to study at Ichthys. But "Bible Basics", despite the name, is essentially a complete systematic theology wherein the issues covered in Peter et. al. are examined in much greater depth. For more on the awesome nature of our God, see BB 1: Theology (at the link).

In Jesus,

Bob L.

Question #16:  

Dr Bob (or do you prefer another title?).

Good to meet you too.

I apologize, because I had not looked through your site and only caught one three-part article and it was that I referenced. It was the article “The False Doctrine of Absolute Eternal Security I, II, III”. The specific statement I was referencing with my first counsel was this one “Moreover, God disciplines us for our sin, and He knows very well just how to make us rue our sin (see the link: "The Fact and Purpose of Divine Discipline").”

As referenced in your article people are not on pins and needles salvation. That means they do not momentarily fluctuate between saved and unsaved. When people drift from God, He sometimes attempts to bring them back, especially with those that are His people. This is done through discipline. But this is the specific reference in Amos 4. God’s purposes was to bring back those had drifted. They had not ceased being His people; at least at that time. When God disciplines people he is discipling believers as you say. The people in Israel at that time did believe even if their actions were inconsistent with their beliefs. Remember that God disciplined the Israelites leaving Egypt too and they had a constant reminder that He was with them. Yet God’s discipline did not bring about in this case the repentance and trust He desired. In fact it’s the posture of much of the modern church that believers live inconsistent with what they believe (although the early church did not believe this). This is the essence of the purpose of discipline, to call people back to God who were drifting in the faith. They did not reject God outright but by their actions showed they were drifting. Once they are completely gone, it is judgment. I would also offer that the discipline of God could be much more selective if He desired it, but when nations are disciplined so are the individuals within in most cases however I take your point as regards Jeremiah.

I am aware of the remnant of the tribes of Israel and did not say anything that contradicted that as far as I know. So we agree here.

For those that love God of course…..it does not say that plan applies to all people or all events in the universe (next paragraph). We agree on where our free will comes from.

I recognize how wise and wonderful God is and agree. It is much less clear to me that he foreordained (that is using the definition of ordain: to order or decree by virtue of superior authority), all events. Allowing something is not causing something. If you have an article you can point me to that supports that biblically I would appreciate it. However if God actually ordains, that is decrees, every event, that does make God logically, the source of evil which is not consistent with my understanding of who God is.

Furthermore, I don’t think the statement that God ordains (again as defined by the classical definition of ordain) everything comports with your statement about human free will. We agree that God knows all past, present, and future events and agree that God is outside of time but as far as being the cause of all events, I doubt this with the difference being between the subtlety between foreknowledge and causality. I don’t dispute that what God does is perfect, yet the creatures he deals with are not and for Him to afford them the ability to choose there are things that God has desired and even decreed which do not occur because of man. For example how do you answer when God says things will happen but they don’t. This happens at both the national and individual levels. I actually have an answer to this but not sure you would agree but would really like your perspective here.

I will take your other counsel although I am not sure the reason as relates to the issues I raise. My guess is we agree on sin but am intrigued as to what you may have to say about it. I have studied through this and will be interested to see if we come up with the same conclusions.

I am sure you are busy and if this seems too taxing, no problem. I will understand.

All His best and thanks for engaging.

Response #16: 

"Bob" is just fine.

Re: "My guess is we agree on sin but am intrigued as to what you may have to say about it.": Best place for the full scope of Ichthys' teachings on sin is at the link: BB 3B: Hamartiology.

Re: "Allowing something is not causing something." Certainly not (I never said anything like that).

Re: "I don’t think the statement that God ordains (again as defined by the classical definition of ordain) everything comports with your statement about human free will": Best place to access the teachings on how free will and the plan of God interact is in BB 4B: Soteriology, the section on "Free-will faith and the Will of God" (at the link).

Have a look at these links, and then feel free to ask regarding anything you have questions about.

In Jesus,

Bob L.

Question #17:  

Hi Mr. Luginbill,

I'm feeling bad because I've failed. I gave into temptation to a particular weakness of mine. Whenever I sin in this way, I always feel awful and I always want to confess right then - but I think only because I am scared of what God might do. I know that I am supposed to have the proper attitude in confession, not just rote prayers but actually a repentant heart.

I try to have the correct attitude, and I try to purpose in myself that the next time I am tempted, I will not sin. But I usually do. Even though it makes me so unhappy and scared. What do I do to make sure my attitude of repentance is genuine? I know it's wrong, and hurts my relationship with Jesus, and I still keep doing it. I'm afraid God's going to lose patience with me. I want to conquer it once and for all, but I think it will be a fight. How do I confess this when I keep messing up over and over? I don't want God to be tired to me and my sin, I do want to make Him pleased. I want to be on the straight and narrow. I haven't been feeling well for a few days and now I am afraid He might just lose patience with me.

Respectfully,

Response #17: 

Please take heart. We all stumble and we all fail from time to time.

When they sin against You – for there is no man who does not sin . . .
1st Kings 8:46a (2Chron.6:36a)

If You, O Lord, kept a close watch on [our] iniquities, then who, O Lord, could stand?
Psalm 130:3

For there is no man on earth who is [so] righteous that he [always] does what is good and [never] sins.
Ecclesiastes 7:20

For all sin and fall short of God's glory.
Romans 3:23

For we all stumble (i.e., sin) in many ways.
James 3:2a

Granted, we are supposed to be staying far clear of sin, and pursuing sanctification (Heb.12:14; 1Pet.1:15-16). But everyone falters from time to time. When we do, we need to remember 1) that all of our sins have already been paid for by Jesus Christ (1Jn.2:2); 2) that we were forgiven everything when we believed (1Jn.2:12); 3) that we are forgiven as believers whenever we sin as soon as we confess our sins to Him (1Jn.1:9); 4) that He is our Advocate before the Father when we do sin (1Jn.2:1).

Feeling bad when we fail is normal. In fact, it is part of the divine discipline which comes to believers who are actually trying to "fight the fight". We naturally will be determined NOT to fail the next time, and all the more so to the extent that we are feeling bad about our failure now. So next time we should remember how we are feeling now. And it's also good to keep in mind that if we are not feeling bad enough to avoid this same trap laid down by the devil next time, that the Lord is capable of making us feel even worse, so that if we are slow on the uptake, we can expect our Savior – in love and concern for us, not in anger and vindictiveness – to amp up the "medicine" until we finally get the "dose" necessary to cure us of whatever the problem may be.

Rejoice that you are a child of God! Rejoice that Jesus loves you as part of His precious Bride! Rejoice in all of the wonderful things in store for us as the Church of Jesus Christ!

And make mental note the next time out to be better at applying the truth, listening to the Spirit, and avoiding whatever things contribute to defeat.

The LORD is merciful and gracious,
Slow to anger, and abounding in mercy.
He will not always strive with us,
Nor will He keep His anger forever.
He has not dealt with us according to our sins,
Nor punished us according to our iniquities.
For as the heavens are high above the earth,
So great is His mercy toward those who fear Him;
As far as the east is from the west,
So far has He removed our transgressions from us.
As a father pities his children,
So the LORD pities those who fear Him.
Psalm 103:8-13 NKJV

Keep growing in grace through the truth, and don't allow one trip-up to rob you of your spiritual momentum – that is just what Satan wants.

In Jesus our patient, loving and merciful Savior,

Bob L.

Question #18:  

Hi Mr. Luginbill,

You always encourage me, and help me to keep fighting the fight, although I still have a long ways to improve. I think I am making progress, but I know there are a lot of things I can do better.

Thank you for your patience with me. I'll try not to bother you for awhile!

Respectfully,

Response #18: 

Thanks for the good words!

It's no bother. Please feel free to write any time.

In Jesus,

Bob L.

Question #19:  

I think I am very slowly learning spiritual ways of thinking.

Today my car is at the mechanic. And a taxi was supposed to pick me. I will spare you the waiting an hour calling, and having to rebook twice, and skip to that the mechanic was nice enough to drive me about 13ish minutes to my apartment and may help me again a little later when the car is ready.

And normally I would be really freaking out because I would have thought, what if he won't or can't help, what if I lose the job because I can't get my car on time, etc. I will admit to being a bit stressed and anxious. But not like before. I was thinking that the apostles were often in what we might call desperate situations, and it is good for me to learn how to handle them especially if I live through the Tribulation. So I don't feel as put upon (like 'some strange thing is happening').

I mean there is also a little general worldly confidence from experience too, but it is also the other thing I just mentioned. I just wanted to share that with you.

Tomorrow I am off. I sometimes wake up with headaches and then am very limited in what I can do dailies/studying wise (have to be gentle mentally).

And so sometimes I try a little drawing and recorder. Is it bad or useless to even do them though? I mean you'd need to do it regularly to be any good, and what good is drawing well? And being more regular would take away from the dailies. Oh goodness I am going to just not think for a while. Goodnight!

Response #19: 

Sounds to me as if you handled this unexpected pressure very well. Anyone can be shocked by negative and trying events that surprise us. Mature believers recover quickly and put things into the broader spiritual perspective . . . just like you did!

Hope you feel better soon too (your R&R seems very healthy and reasonable to me!).

In Jesus,

Bob L.

Question #20:  

Thanks! Two more short questions I have.

I get why people call the prosperity gospel the prosperity "gospel" but, in a certain sense, isn't the word "gospel" something that needs to be explained a bit in detail since many churches that adhere to this teaching teach that salvation is by faith through grace alone (which means they are teaching the true gospel)? The teaching is obviously false and dangerous with many risks that make apostasy all the more likely for those who hold to that belief (in the end, nothing will have mattered if you stopped believing). However, I do believe that many people who attend said churches are actually saved (even if not all of them). If a person has believed in Christ alone, they are a believer and they are saved, even if they end up believing in the prosperity gospel later on. I know the issue with Laodicea has to do with wealth and much of the distractions and worries of this life (yet we know they are still genuine believers), but I never took that to mean most in the church are (and have been) lukewarm mostly because of the health and wealth teaching. I have heard people call the prosperity gospel a "false" gospel. But is it really a gospel presentation since many of them believe in and teach faith by grace alone? The problem is that it makes it sound as if everyone who believes in that false teaching hasn't truly come to Christ and aren't genuine believers just because they hold to that belief.

Onto my other question, (I'm writing a small topical on this), we are told not to take the Lord's name in vain. However, many swear words don't mention God's name at all, the Sh** word for example. I have heard people say that word when, for example, something scared them, and they go, "oh sh**! I would imagine this to be an example of something unwholesome (Ephesians 4:29) I understand swearing is never a good idea. Another example- He's a D*M good worker! I've heard that one plenty of times too. But can we say with absolute certainty that swearing (with words not involving the Lord's name) is always sinful? Can they be sinful? Of course they can and often are because they are used in all sorts of sinful ways by people all the time. But in every single instance (depends on what word is used and how it is being used- the motives behind them)? What is your view on this and what do you think of the examples I provided?

Response #20:

Sorry for the delay.

1) The word "gospel" actually embraced the entirety of the good news of the kingdom (see the link); so in that sense, I suppose it's not really a misnomer. However, I do get what you are saying. For many things in life and in all fields of endeavor we are "stuck" with poorly named concepts and other things – but we use those names because that way people we know what we are talking about.

2) On the second question, using foul language is not the same thing as blasphemy or "taking the Lord's Name in vain". However, it's not a good idea for believers to indulge in it because it reflects poorly on us and on the Lord (your citation of Eph.4:29 is spot on). As with all things, this is a matter of application so that the extent and type of restraint any individual believer chooses to use is between him/her and the Lord.

In the USMC, swearing of this sort was just part of normal everyday communication. I was careful not to take the Lord's Name in vain when I was in but didn't bother to refrain from salting my speech with curse words . . . until a fellow officer who was a believer took me aside one time and said, "I appreciate the fact that you don't misuse the Lord's Name, but I have a problem with your use of swear words". I decided that, while it wasn't a huge issue, given the environment, it was apparently causing some fellow believers unnecessary distress . . . and not giving the best witness.

We don't want to be legalistic about this (excommunicating someone from our fellowship if they shout "d***" after stubbing their toe), but this is surely a case where in most venues "less is better". And in the example given, just whom are we upset with, and just whom are we cursing? Anything said in anger is likely going to be regretted later.

In Jesus,

Bob L.

P.S.:  If you haven't noticed or already done so, please check out the list of wonderful ministry offerings on the Special Topics page, including Jordan Bomberger's new Bible teaching website: Bible Driven, Mike Ceja's new YouTube channel, "Everything is Fine", John Jackson's Hub pages (anyone with questions about the "church-visible" will find this helpful), the Expanded Index to Old Testament translations at Ichthys, Foundational Principles, by Odii Ariwodo, "The Peter series", Video presentations by Steven Tammen based on the SR series, and Steven's group studies of BB 6A (see also Steven's new website: BibleDocs).