Question #1:
Dear Robert,
Re: Believers in the World XIII [posted 3/23/24]
Q. 13 Response referenced John 8:7 whereas you state the John 7:53 – 8:11
passage is most definitely not scripture and should be discarded from any
consideration as the false interpolation it is.
Nine years ago while searching for something unrelated (but obviously
‘searching’) I came across a short explanation of The Genesis Gap Theory online,
which referenced ichthys.com
Your generous referencing, easily verified using Reftagger, gave me great
confidence in your writings, which I’ve devoured (though at my very slow reading
pace) ever since. The fact that we are close in age and culture has also given a
sense of affinity.
So many times over nearly one decade I’ve wanted to write, though I am even
slower at this. Mostly the questions I’ve had you’ve answered through the Q&A of
others. I am a little ashamed of not providing encouragement or saying thank you
before now, though these things have been in my prayers often.
I do have one or two ‘fish bones’ set aside but I feel a need to prepare really
well before engaging with you.
The above reference to Jn8:7, however, seems more than a fish bone so I’m really
waiting to be shown that I’ve absolutely misunderstood something. I know you’d
never quote the doctrines of men as scripture, so what have I missed?
Respectfully,
Response #1:
Good to make your acquaintance.
Of course, this passage is not part of scripture (as I have often most
emphatically pointed out;
see the
link).
As I have often remarked (though more to my students at the university than in
this ministry), I am terrible with remembering numbers. In fact, I have a sort
of numerical dyslexia wherein the number I look up gets changed to a different
one in transferring vision from a source to the written page. Anyone who has
used Reftagger to check my references will recognize this is so (many unintended
such errors), so that I am always grateful for readers who point out these sorts
of typos – often more difficult to discern than the normal type.
The passage I was meaning to reference was John 8:46, not 8:7. Change made.
Thank you for your help! Some mistakes are more embarrassing than others.
Feel free to write any time.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #2:
Hi Bob,
I am happy to say that __ and I read from Scripture together. I only had
short notice but the Spirit led me just under an hour to piece together
a Gospel harmony over all the events that led up to our Lord's
crucifixion.
I really hope it is a witness to ___ who is used to going to Catholic
church to do the 'Stations of the Cross' which is supposed to be a
spiritual exercise to get Catholics 'closer to God'. She was surprised
how much the Bible differs from what is taught in Catholicism, no
mention of Veronica wiping Jesus' face or Him falling with the cross
three times.
The problem though is I think she still thinks that the Catholic church
is right and the Bible must be wrong here. She has often been suspicious
of my King James Bible as being a 'Protestant Bible'. She is very
suspicious of Protestantism in the main, believing it was only to give
Henry VIII a divorce. This is Catholic propaganda and very difficult to
shift.
However, when she told me that people are walking up a local mountain
today carrying wooden crosses and how good this is to promote
Christianity. I did say that to 'carry one's cross' wasn't meant to be
literal and that this was a false Catholic tradition of pilgrimages
meant to shorten time in purgatory (which doesn't exist).
I said that Jesus said that people say they love Him but don't do what
He asks us to do. That to find out what He wants us to do, we have to
read the Bible first but most don't want to do this and instead want to
do what they want to do (carrying a cross in front of lots of people)
rather than actually being obedient to Jesus.
I also pointed out that trying to recreate Jesus' crucifixion was
actually very insulting and suggests that we are somehow on equal
footing with Christ by attempting this. This didn't go down well at all.
I know that people will not know any of this without discerning what is
true and we can only know what is true by reading the Bible whilst
having the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. Otherwise people can make it
up as they go along and expect God to be grateful for whatever they do
'in the name of Christ'.
John 4:19-24
“Sir,” the woman said, “I see that You are a prophet. Our fathers
worshiped on this mountain, but you Jews say that the place where one
must worship is in Jerusalem.” “Believe Me, woman,” Jesus replied, “a
time is coming when you will worship the Father neither on this mountain
nor in Jerusalem. You worship what you do not know; we worship what we
do know, for salvation is from the Jews. But a time is coming and has
now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and
in truth, for the Father is seeking such as these to worship Him. God is
Spirit, and His worshipers must worship Him in spirit and in truth.”
No doubt the coming Antichrist will have a lot of rituals like that
which will seem holy to many and people will be angry when you point out
it is anything but.
I have to say that personally I really benefitted from piecing the
Gospels together today and also doing an in depth study of your section
on the Jewish Ceremonial Calendar.
Hope you are having a peaceful Good Friday my friend.
In Jesus,
Response #2:
Good to hear that you made some headway with __; sorry to learn that it
wasn't a perfect "exercise".
On piecing things together, if you haven't already seen it, in
BB 4A Christology, under section I, part 5,
"The
Life of Christ", I have a complete "harmony", as it's sometimes
called, of the events of passion week ("The
Last Passover").
When you say, "She was surprised how much the Bible differs from what is
taught in Catholicism", that is a fairly common experience . . . for RCs
who ever get around to reading the Bible. But if they wanted to know
what God really wanted from them, what was really the truth, why
wouldn't they have started reading it long ago? For most RCs, they are
happy where they are. They are not really interested in the truth.
Two other things really hit home with your email. The KJV objection –
funny, isn't it, because so many today are on the other side seeing that
as THE only version – is a typical "tell" of people who are not really
interested in the truth you're trying to convey to them. They find some
angle, some small objection, some "bone in the fish" to focus on so as
to be able to reject everything else you are telling them. They don't
really care about the bone. They don't want the fish.
The other thing is the works-aspect you mention. The RC religion is a
religion of works from top to bottom, and it is so successful because so
many people like it that way. They like the idea of "doing something for
God". And they like the idea of obligating Him, so to speak, by doing
things they deem acceptable – without any regard to what He actually
wants or says. They like making religion a transactional business.
The sad thing here from my perspective is how many Protestants do the
same thing, even if in more subtle ways. "I'll carry a cross up a hill
and you'll have to bless me" is pretty obvious since it takes no genius
to realize that is NOT what "pick up your cross daily" means at all. But
tithing, water-baptizing, church attendance and all manner of annoying
evangelical behaviors are essentially the same thing.
Praise the Lord for the truth . . . and for His provision of it to us
bountifully, to any and all who really want it.
Keeping you in my prayers, my friend!
In Jesus,
Bob L.
p.s., thanks so much for yours. I made it through this week in spite of
a major disaster and potential catastrophe yesterday . . . which God
made good and averted respectively. Thanks be to the Lord and to
wonderful Christians like yourself who join in battle in prayer for me
and this ministry.
Question #3:
Thanks so much Bob!
Sorry to be always taking up your precious time lately, to be honest I have
needed the fellowship very keenly. At times this walk can get very lonely...
I went to ___'s funeral today. It was at the Catholic church I was raised in. At
first I was quite impressed that the priest put the Gospel front and centre and
talked at length about it all being about Jesus Christ. I was very happily
surprised but sadly this didn't last very long as the priest then made a
'sacrifice' on the altar and asked us all to pray intercession so that ___
would be allowed into heaven.
There would have been one time of day that I wouldn't have a clue about what any
of it meant (or whether it would be effective) but sadly (for the congregation)
I see where it all is and where it leads. It made me realise how profoundly
blessed I am to have the truth now!
Again, thank you so very much for your ministering, fellowship and
uncompromising stand for the truth.
Keep fighting the good fight my friend!
In Jesus,
p.s. you know how you write of 'epignosis'? Today I had a profound full
knowledge in faith of what is in the Word. I really knew in my heart of hearts
that other people are not our enemies at all. That our true enemies are Satan
and his army, our sin natures and death itself. Happily all conquered by our
wonderful Saviour on the cross for us and forever!
Response #3:
It's my great pleasure, my friend. I'm always happy to hear from you.
Very interesting about the service. I have had similar experiences many
times, though not so many in Catholic churches. Genuine believers in
Jesus Christ think as you are thinking, seeing the evil one as the enemy
and every unbeliever as a potential believer, wanting their good, just
as we want the good of our fellow believers, even when they too are off
in left field somewhere. As a result, we tend to think the best of
everyone and look for the good in everything. This is a fine tendency,
but as we grow we learn to temper it with realism and truth in the
Spirit.
Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth.
1st Corinthians 13:6 NIV
We WANT what is good always, but we have to be realistic and critical in our analysis of things, not cynical, but prudent . . . as when being careful not to cast our pearls before swine, for example. When it comes to things such as your service, we look to hear what is good and we rejoice when we hear something that is true. But we are also, in our spiritual discretion, mindful of where the reading or the hymn or the sermon departs from the truth – and it really is the case that a little leaven is capable of leavening the entire lot, especially when that leaven is potent and/or plentiful. "Believe in Jesus Christ . . . and get water-baptized/join our church/become sinless/etc. . . . and you will be saved!" is not the gospel; that is the antithesis of the gospel.
For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,
not of works, lest anyone should boast.
Ephesians 2:8-9 NKJV
For the Roman Catholics and every other legalistic group or church, it
is the case of a false gospel of works. For many Protestant
places/services of which I have personal experience, it is a case of a
tiny bit of truth insufficient to produce growth or even spiritual
safety – and often mixed with a great heaping of toxic leaven. In some
of these mega-church palaces it's like being led into an elaborate
dining hall seated in a luxurious chair, having the best china and
silver service placed before you by immaculate and impressively dressed
waiters . . . and then being served a single stale cracker that is
supposed to suffice for the entire week (often with a covering of mold
on it too). So the effect of the tiny bit of truth may only be to bait
the hungry diner in, only to poison or starve or make him ill later (as
the case my be).
Congratulations on your growing spiritual discernment (link),
my friend!
Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by this renewal of your thinking, so that you may discern what God's will for you is, namely what it is good, well-pleasing, and correct [for you to do].
Romans 12:2 (cf. Rom.2:17-18)
(9) And this is my prayer: that your love may abound more and more in full-knowledge and in all discernment, (10) so that you may be able to evaluate the things that are good and appropriate [for you to do] to be sincere and without offense in regard to the day of Christ (i.e., to gain a maximum reward at Christ's judgment seat), (11) full of the righteous production Jesus Christ [commends] to the glory and praise of God.
Philippians 1:9-11
Solid [spiritual] food is for the [spiritually] mature, those who by [diligent] practice have trained their [moral] perceptive faculties to [properly] distinguish between good and evil.
Hebrews 5:14
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #4:
Dear Sir:
What I find dismaying is how when I read of the history of socialism and
communism starting with Plato's Republic in the West and heresies since
the 1st century.
The insistence that Equality is God's will. And that private property
and monogamy should be abolished. In favor of egalitarian communality of
property and wives.
Even many cults who arose after the Reformation like the Anabaptists are
like this.
The same hatred of excellence and love of Equality.
What's the Biblical answer to this notion that Equality and abolition of
Hierarchy is God's will allegedly and those cults who love this?
Response #4:
The short answer: "it's nowhere in the Bible".
About the only passage which can be found which relates any sort of
commonality is the situation which existed for a very
short period of time in Jerusalem following the first Pentecost of the
Church Age. The believers there were said to have "all things in common"
(Acts 2:44; 4:32). But as the second passage makes clear, this was based
on a decision from the heart of all those so involved; it wasn't forced
nor was it coerced in any way. Also, it was not total in the sense that
people think of or might suspect based on a casual reading. Barnabas
sold a field and gave the proceeds to the apostles. This was obviously a
generous act – but not commanded. Before this act, Barnabas was the one
in sole possession of the field. We find out in the next chapter, Acts
chapter five, that Ananias and Sapphira also sold a field and gave part
of the proceeds to the apostles. They lied about that, and were taken
from this life by God as a result, not because they didn't give
all of the money to the apostles – they weren't required to sell
it or give up the proceeds of it in any case – but because they wanted
to make it seem that they had done as Barnabas had done. They wanted
credit for what they had done, and false credit at that (the essence of
"works" salvation). Peter says the following:
"Didn’t it (i.e., the field) belong to you before it was sold? And after it was sold, wasn’t the money at your disposal?"
Acts 5:4b NIV
Meaning that while the believers were helping each other at this time,
sometimes sacrificially, they hadn't parted with all of their private
property nor were they required or expected to do so. So even this
purported "Christian communism" was anything but. What it was, was a
short period of respite for the seed planted on Pentecost to be able to
grow by allowing the whole group of new believers – who had to go "from
zero to sixty" in virtually no time – to be focused on learning the
truth in preparation for the expansion of the Church. Those who "had"
were motivated by the Spirit (not required by some regime) to be
generous so that all could do this without, for that very brief time,
having to be concerned about making a living.
This period was very short, as mentioned. Later on, we are told in no
uncertain terms that instead of freeloading, Christians should work for
a living (e.g., 1Thes.4:11-12; Eph.4:28; 2Thes.3:10-12; cf. 1Tim.5:16).
Giving is always to be voluntary, not mandatory (passim in
scripture; cf. 2Cor.9:7).
Nowhere does the Bible suggest that anything other than monogamy is
salutary; even though polygamy was not unlawful, all the biblical
examples of it and statements about it demonstrate that it is not God's
first, best way (see
the link), and polygamy invalidates a man from being a
pastor-teacher or having any other position of responsibility in a local
church (1Tim.3:2; 3:12; Tit.1:6). Sexual indiscretion of any sort is
always condemned in scripture (e.g., 1Cor.6:18).
It should also be observed that cults and political philosophies which
denounce the standard system of law and nationalism which God has
ordained in order to restrain crime and evil in the world as something
to be torn down and replaced, always seek to substitute their own
hierarchical systems wherein their leaders become the new potentates –
but not based upon tradition or ability or justice, just based upon
power. God's system allows for sufficient freedom to seek Him and His
Son and do Christ's will in this world; the other "equality" systems
only deliver the equality of slavery for the powerless they rule over,
and do much to take away any opportunity for salvation and spiritual
growth – exactly as you would expect from anything emanating from the
devil (as all of those anti-God systems clearly do).
While we are on the cusp of experiencing the most anti-truth,
anti-justice, anti-God system of world rulership in history under the
regime of the beast (and seeing some of the precursors of that today),
we believers can look forward to the most blessed and wonderful time of
true justice under the millennial reign of the King of Kings, our dear
Savior Jesus Christ. There won't be "equality" of status or property –
but everyone will have the equal opportunity to seek the truth.
That is really the equality we should praise today as well, and even
though there are great and growing injustices here and now, the real
thing to be bemoaned is that more believers here in Laodicea are not
taking and making the most of the opportunities God is providing to grow
spiritually, advance with Jesus Christ, and enter into ministry to help
others do likewise . . . while there is still time to do so.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #5:
Dear Sir:
They even imagine that Heaven like the Garden of Eden will have everyone
be equal. But neither Adam nor Eve were equal. As Adam named his wife
"woman" making him the Head. In their Paradise everyone is one
collective and the same.
And there are even grades of rewards like what the "parable of the
Talents" and the "parable of the Minas" seem to indicate graded payments
and Authority according to Merit.
I have read an analysis on Socialism in history:
http://robertlstephens.com/essays/shafarevich/001SocialistPhenomenon.html
It seems like there is a constant tendency throughout history. Starting
with the more Despotic States in History. Until Christianity started
dissolving those States by elevating the dignity of Humanity especially
his Individual dignity and uniqueness.
It seems that from the Gnostics onwards. Those types hate the
incarnation of Jesus Christ as Man. Of joining Divine and Human. Or the
cross. And for a time those Demons tried on a Christian guise even unto
the Anabaptists of Munster. As time goes by. They drop the Christian
mask. And overt hatred of Christianity ended up resulting.
It seems that the higher the Animal and more closer to Humanity the more
inequality but also there is unity. Ants/Bees are Eusocial are far more
socialistic yet they are a far lower order of lifeform to other Animals
who are more Hierarchical and Individualistic.
And the Individuality of each human being is courtesy of the Image of
God in Man. Equality is the abolition of all that to nothing.
Ironically Equality is maximal entropy of a dead universe. In this
fashion the purportedly High Ideal is actually evil. What do you think?
Response #5:
Nice observations, my friend. The devil has always been adept at
providing lies that people have found appealing. And he doesn't limit
himself to one. Nevertheless, his system of lies always focuses on the
same three principles: 1) first, try to get people to think they don't
need God; 2) second, try to get people to think that they are just as
good as Him or equal to Him; 3) try finally to get them to feel superior
to God through whatever system of false teaching we are talking about (link).
Arrogance is obviously behind the hardening of heart necessary to go
down this turnpike of deceit, and there is plenty of that in the human
heart naturally (since the fall: e.g., Jer.17:9). God has a nice way of
humbling everyone, however. If not immediately (there are plenty out
there who won't respond in this life, no matter what), eventually:
It is written: “ ‘As surely as I live,' says the Lord, ‘every knee will bow before me; every tongue will acknowledge God.' "
Romans 14:11 (from Is.45:23; cf. Phil.2:10)
There's plenty about the Gnostics and the devil's system of deceit at
the following link (if you haven't seen it yet):
Peter #39: "False teachers and false teaching".
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #6:
Indeed. And thanks for the link. What I notice about all cults and even large
scale cults in the 20th Century and possibly still ongoing today in Countries
they rule is the attempt at homogenizing personality and making people the same
as much as possible.. By suppressing individuality through equality through
forced communalization and other forms of psychological coercion.
Results in an absolute despotism far more terrible than all the Kingdoms they
previously decried as unequal as you noted before.
People are reduced to hard working automatons who only receive programming which
they obey. Because they get melted into the collective thereby losing their own
distinctiveness. As a system of enslavement it is quite apt with what happens
when Satan is allowed a free hand without God. I see this too with too many
Jehovah's Witnesses who seem like Robots with pre-programmed code rather than
real Individual Human Beings.
What a contrast with God's rule that upholds Individual human distinctiveness
and Dignity. And the inherent inequality that God has built into reality and
even the New Heavens and Earth in the future is itself an affirmation of our
Individual Agency ironically.
Response #6:
Nicely said, my friend!
One difference between the likes of the JWs and the many repressive
regimes currently holding sway on planet earth is that the former is a
voluntary slavery – at least at first. Of course all cults are practiced
in making it as hard as possible – impossible if possible – to ever
escape their grasp once engaged by 1) having their slaves cut off all
prior connections and burn all their bridges with other people to the
ground, and 2) costing them so much that the natural tendency to throw
"good money after bad" kicks in, since their slaves are unwilling to
admit that they have suffered and sacrificed so much in vain (which of
course they absolutely have).
Repressive regimes are, in the modern era, much into "mind control", but
that has its limits. As the old German folk song goes, "Die Gedanken
sind frei" ("Thoughts are free"). All unwilling slaves are very much
likely to be biding their time. There are plenty of revolutions in
history which affirm this (whether successful or not, it still proves
the point). The current unrest in Iran in the face of a very strong
system of state repression is a good contemporary example. We will also
see this during the Tribulation. The world will rally around antichrist
in a way analogous to following Nimrod (see
the link), but after a few years of his repressive reign, Babylon
will revolt at the first opportunity, the event that occasions her
destruction (see
the link).
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #7:
Hi Bob,
How are you doing? Hope you had a nice peaceful Christmas. I just wanted to give
you an update on things here.
I think I may have dodged a bullet from the enemy. There is a lady who lives
opposite__. She is an evangelical Christian and so my family have kept saying
why not go to her prayer meetings. There were times I really considered it but I
always had a firm conviction not to. This conviction was so strong and
impossible to ignore.
On paper it all looked good: her deceased husband was a missionary, she takes
Bibles to people in hospitals and prisons, drives around with a huge Bible decal
on the side of the car and has regular prayer meetings at her house. All the
work on her house is done by a local handyman who has 'Jesus is King' plastered
all over his huge work van. On paper it should be a no brainer but I always
thought no.
Well this Christmas I was just dropping off a birthday present and Christmas
card from ___ there and they invited me in and I had never been inside before.
They lavished attention on me and asked me a million questions and on one hand I
felt flattered by the full attention but also felt uneasy at the same time.
There was quite a lot of family in the room and despite my bubbliness, some of
them looked utterly miserable and others looked suspicious of me.
They told me that they had just finished playing a 'game' that they play every
year and I was pretty disturbed by what they said. They get blindfolded and they
get a peg on their nose and have to drink whatever they are given and say what
it is. Sometimes it is just Cola but then sometimes it is pickle brine or dish
soap. This lady who is meant to be a mature Christian thought it hilarious and
at that point I wanted to get out of there in case they wanted to do it on me.
I thought before that I was too cynical and mistrustful to avoid this family who
are right on my doorstep but now I feel relieved for my caution. The way I
discern it is that for a person to play such a 'game' on their children and
grandchildren would have to be an immature believer at best or an unbeliever at
worst. A mature believer simply wouldn't do such a 'game' with their family.
I also was given pause when ___ told me that she is a real 'matriarch' over the
family and her husband had to follow her. I think she also leads in a mixed
group Bible teaching so none of this sounds promising does it.
Of course I would love to have such easy access to fellowship but I always
reckoned that if it went wrong it would make seeing ___harder than it already
is. I know this family recently left a Methodist church to go to a Pentecostal
as they didn't like the way the Methodists were going.
From my limited experience of Laodicea, the church is only going in two
directions : towards liberalism and a compromise with sin and the world or
towards rigid legality and empty ritual. So whether they went from legalism to
liberalism or vice versa is anyone's guess. Hopefully they left because they
actually wanted to hear the Word and grow, I hope so.
I find it disturbing that a missionary's wife who spends all day in hospitals
and prisons goes home to feed her family dish soap for fun. Maybe you think I am
being too judgemental but it left a bad taste in the mouth for me (pardon the
pun.)
I am just trying each day to keep up prayer and study and try to pass tests with
faith to grow in the Lord.
I hope this finds you well. We are only two days away from 2023 which means our
Lord's return draws closer with each passing day, week, month and year. It
cannot come too soon for me! Maranatha.
A happy, holy and productive New Year for you and your family in the Lord, my
friend!
In Jesus,
p.s., I was just talking to __ about Philippians 4:8 and how it has always been
one of my personal favourite verses in Scripture. When I was a baby Christian
though I just saw them as exceedingly pretty and noble words but now I see them
in a much more keener spiritual light. I see the urgency and great necessity to
these words and the prettiness has been replaced with the weighty profundity of
truth. I realise more than ever now in these increasingly darkening days, just
how important these words from my favourite verses are. Indeed words to live by.
I realise that I do not often bring you words of good report my friend and
rarely bring you lovely words. That, then is something else for me to improve
upon. I want to strive to always be a blessing to you and my brethren in Christ
but also to the unbelieving loved ones around me. I can only do that if I only
have Jesus on my mind and on my heart and lips!
You have written that the best way to see Jesus everyday is to imitate Him and
be guided by the Spirit in all things so as to reflect His glory to others.
Amen! I realise how precious this is to such a grimly bleak world we now find
ourselves in.
So I need to keep on with this despite all the seemingly innumerable odds
against it. My hope must be always evident. He will never let us down. We may
fail and fall down but He never will. In Him we are more than conquerors. Though
we must take hold of this hope and hold onto it and believe with everything
we've got to the very end.
In Jesus,
Response #7:
It was a nice Christmas – and it's been a nice break (although I haven't
gotten as much done as I had hoped for). Glad to hear yours was nice –
sorry to hear that your efforts were not appreciated (but no great
surprise there).
Also not surprising to hear that this person with all the outward show
of Christ has little of the inner power which a genuine believer who is
growing and walking with Him should have. That's not unusual either, not
in this church era of Laodicea in any case. Good to hear that you had
your "spiritual common sense" instincts confirmed as working well, at
least! And also good to hear that you were able to extricate yourself
before getting caught up in something you might regret.
As to good words, while you do share your challenges with me, you've
also always shared your triumphs and your insights – a nice balance of
all three!
So I do draw encouragement from you already, my friend. Just keep
running that good race for Jesus Christ.
Happy new year in Him!
Bob L.
Question #8:
Hi Bob,
I stumbled across your Ichthys site trying to find a local Lexington, KY
church similar to Berachah. I was a taper in my youth.
Do you have any recommendations? Are you aligned with a local church in
Louisville?
When I travel, I have visited the following similar churches:
Living Word Bible Church - Indianapolis, IN
Grace Doctrine Church - St. Charles, MO
Any help is greatly appreciated!
BTW, I appreciate all the work you have made available on your website!
Thank you,
Response #8:
Good to make your acquaintance.
No, I'm not familiar with any such church in KY. In fact, Berachah is not what
it was when the Col. was there, after all. I have no affiliation with any local
church. What you find here in Louisville is pretty much what you find everywhere
else (so that explains that).
There is an Ichthys forum (courtesy of Steven T.) where a number of believers
get together online pretty much weekly to study and discuss scripture. Happy to
ask him to send you an invite if interested.
Thanks very much for the good words!
Do feel free to write me back any time.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #9:
Hi Bob,
That would be great if you could pass my contact information along.
I should have mentioned that I also visited Berachah about 10 years. It
was not what I expected. I spoke with R.B. Thieme III after the service.
In this sea of churches, I can't help but feel there must be something
local and I just can't find it.
The pastors at the aforementioned churches I have attended also don't
know of any such similar churches in my area. I'm trying to get back on
the path, diligently looking for my "right pastor"
Thanks for the quick response!
Response #9:
Re: "In this sea of churches, I can't help but feel there must be
something local and I just can't find it.", that is a testimony I
have heard many times. One would think . . . but this is
the era of Laodicea, after all, and seeking the truth is not what
"church" is about anymore (here's a link on that:
"Finding a
church or something better II").
I'm sending your name and email to Steven T. If you haven't heard from
him in about a week or so, let me know (all mail service these days have
upped their "junk mail" surveillance efforts . . . which doesn't stop
SPAM, but it does often block legitimate messages with any sort of links in
them).
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #10:
Thanks for all the helpful answers and input. I'm reconsidering attempting to
plug into Bible studies because I will admit that something just seems off about
the whole thing (hence I brought this up in our discussion). I don't know, I
just feel like some intruder in a place where I don't belong. I haven't been
enjoying all this to tell you the truth. What I'm trying to figure out are other
ways to "get off the park bench" that don't involve going to some group. Like,
other ways to meet believers outside of some organized scheme hosted by a church
and led by someone else. That's the difficult part and I admit I don't have an
answer. I pray and ask the Lord that He would provide something but if not
through an organized study/meeting then what? I suppose only time and spiritual
growth will tell. Then again, maybe it just isn't meant to happen.
On the website, I will admit to being a little discouraged/disappointed with
that at times. I don't care about numbers because it isn't about that (I don't
have any features that allow me to see how many people visit the site because I
don't really care about that). It isn't like I want or need that much but at
least something would be better than nothing. As is the case when I recommend
Ichthys, every time I've introduced people to my site I would never hear back
from them again after that. Complete silence. Nevertheless, writing online
teachings is what I've been called to (not leading an in-person group) and that
I will continue to do. Yes, I'm a little discouraged but those feelings haven't
stopped me from continuing to write and add to the site (I just finished
completing my latest large topical-
https://www.bibledriven.org/large-topical/galatians-5-and-the-fruits-of-the-spirit--indications-of-salvation-and-spiritual-growth/
).
I suppose I got a little too hopeful before launching because I figured people
would just naturally come along and email me. But the site hasn't been online
long enough and, after talking to our friend about it, there aren't really that
many other ways to make it more visible (he didn't know of much he could
recommend). But the good thing is that if I ever do meet people in person, I
always have something to refer them to (along with Ichthys of course). Like, the
website helps to speak for me in ways I couldn't do face to face. Naturally, I
always point people to your site before my own but I leave mine as a secondary
recommendation. Only thing I'm concerned about is that I don't want to come
across as "advertising" what I have to offer, so I always try to casually
recommend both if the opportunity presents itself. Otherwise, I don't go out of
my way to do so lest people think I'm desperate for attention and what have you
etc. I think you get what I mean. I just don't want people to get the wrong
impression.
All of this kinda makes me think about the hypothetical situation of a
missionary that spends 20 years scouring through the jungle only to end up
reaching a few people despite all the effort. Yet, all that work and effort
hasn't gone unnoticed by the Lord. Then you have the Prophets whose ministries
were largely ignored. I'm not saying this says anything about my spiritual
production or success but I remember this principle of "it isn't about numbers"
as an encouragement and way to comfort myself. Perhaps being under the radar
free from a lot of unwanted attention isn't so bad after all? I mean, look at
Joel Osteen with all the millions of people that follow him? Yet he teaches the
prosperity gospel and all other kinds of false and dangerous teachings.
In His grace and power,
Response #10:
Yes, I wouldn't want to be J.O. at the Judgment Seat of Christ . . . assuming
he's headed there. We're here to do what the Lord wants us to do. Gaining a huge
following with the wrong methods isn't it. Just read John chapter six.
A little perspective. Scofield broke the mold with his study Bible. Chafer
founded a seminary which was non-denominational and wrote a systematic theology
which was likewise not denomination-bound. Thieme developed an audio tape
ministry. Ichthys ventured onto the internet with a website. It strikes me in
thinking about this progression (not that I'm worthy really to be mentioned in
same breath with these other three; this is just an illustration), that if I had
tried an audio tape ministry putting on conferences and starting a face to face
church exactly in the pattern of Col. Thieme, it wouldn't have worked for me. So
maybe you guys should at least consider that you might be better served by
breaking out of the website mold. It's not for me to say you should do so or
even what that might look like. There are a lot of options out there nowadays.
YouTube, Facebook, Instagram, X, and even, shudder, Tik-tok. There are a zillion
podcasts and various ways to market them. Curt Omo is producing videos ala Khan
Academy, as you know. I consider it a compliment that you two have websites . .
. but maybe you'd have more success going another way.
I have probably shared that my Ichthys traffic is declining, in spite of
longevity on the web. Email traffic is also on the decline (still more than
enough for me to have to keep up with; just noting the trend). Getting "noticed"
as a needle in an ever expanding mega-haystack isn't easy, and the rules for
that are constantly changing. Google has recently stopped indexing many of my
pages and the reasons for it are not particularly clear. It'll be a huge project
to get this reversed (and no time for that at least until next summer). Also,
judging from what I hear from my students (mostly Zoomers now with Alphas on the
point of starting to trickle in), things are different than they were. The
number of people who are looking for answers from websites is growing less and
less (just like less and less people are watching TV). So not only is the
haystack getting larger; the number of people looking for that needle in that
place is growing ever smaller as well.
This is just musing. You've got a nice looking site! So does our friend. But
this is Laodicea and there aren't a lot of people out there who are looking to
READ serious Bible study materials. It just is what it is. I'm certain of one
thing. The Lord is preparing you gentlemen for something. Listening carefully is
what we all need to be doing.
Keeping you in my prayers, my friend.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #11:
Something I always take comfort in is that we don't have that much time to wait until the Tribulation (less than three years now as we believe). Once that begins, all this silly Laodicean nonsense will finally come to an end (albeit not without a whole third of the church falling away from the faith). Perhaps the Lord will use me more in person then since believers will need spiritual guidance more than ever before during that period. Till then, other than the website I have now, I don't know how and where else the Lord will use me (I'm not a gifted speaker or into videos or social media to be honest, especially as bad as they've gotten these days). I'm just gonna keep praying about it and for any ___ opportunities the Lord could bring. Your prayers are appreciated.
Response #11:
Re: "we don't have that much time to wait until the Tribulation", I
believe that is correct. But please understand that this (i.e., 2026) is an
interpretation based upon what the Bible, which doesn't name the date, has to
say about God's plan for the ages as we may deduce it from scripture (link).
Re: "Perhaps the Lord will use me more in person then"; that may indeed
be the case . . . for us all. We'll have to wait and see. Meanwhile, we should
all be doing our best (or since that is impossible, I suppose, working very hard
at least) at spiritual growth. Also, we don't want to put everything off until
"that day", even if we are not finding ourselves totally engaged in service at
present.
Re: "I'm not a gifted speaker", Moses said the same thing (Ex.4:10)! And
what did the Lord say to him? "I will help you speak" (Ex.4:12ff.). Paul was
also apparently unimpressive in person (2Cor.10:10), but the Lord certainly used
him mightily. Since this is about the Lord (it's his glory we are seeking:
Jn.7:18; cf. Ps.115:1), all we need to concern ourselves with is what He wants
us to do (not how others may adjudge our effort or even how we might view them
ourselves).
Re: "or into videos or social media", that was just an example. I have no
idea what precisely the Lord is planning for you. Things are changing fast.
Since it's in the tech realm that many of those changes are taking place
(quantum computing?), and since that is where you do have your ministry
footprint at present, it's only natural to consider possibilities in that venue.
I just heard of "Discord" for the first time today (yes, I'm behind the tech
curve, it's true).
On the other issue (and issues), I continue to keep you in my prayers daily, my
friend.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #12:
Dear Professor Luginbill,
I am writing you this Email as I have been wanting to do it for a
moment.
For quite a while, I have been visiting your website from time to time
(thanks to one of your students linking me to your website) and have
seen most of your responses to Emails as well as the In-depth Exegetical
analysis of The Bible to be pretty consistent and well thought (I
haven’t read a lot of the arguments when it comes to grammar because I
have no knowledge whatsoever of Hebrew or Koine Greek but they seem to
be good too.). However, I still often doubt about things.
You see, I used to study with Jehovah Witnesses as a child until I
decided to stop studying for certain reasons (my parents are still JW’s),
However, due to a pretty bad year in overall and a rising problem in
anxiety I decided to come back to Christ and tried to lean towards a
more Trinitarian approach. For several months I have been trying to
understand it, debunking claims against it (so far reading many articles
online has been pretty useful) and yet due to mental issues (such as OCD)
I still struggle to completely trust it. Often I find asking myself
‘what if it isn’t true ?’ what if Jesus was truly just a created being
and not God ?’ and those kind of questions kind of boggles me as well as
hindering my ability to focus while studying (As of writing this I am
still studying for school).
So tell me, how can I convince myself that Christ was Indeed God ?
Without Christ I am nothing, as a child I used to think that the idea of
him being God was ridiculous and even called the Trinity ‘false’ and yet
today he is the only Reason I haven’t ended my life.
The tears I have shed thinking about how God himself loved us so much
that he decided to live an incredibly difficult life and die of a
painful death to pay for our sins might have not been much but it surely
has been motivating me to keep on going.
I apologize if this might be too much, I Simply haven’t been having many
stress-free weeks recently and it has kind of been making me anxious.
I want to thank you in advance if you decide to answer me and I wish you
to have a nice day.
Response #12:
Good to make your acquaintance.
Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen.
Romans 9:5 KJV
(1) God, from antiquity communicated to our fathers in the prophets at many times and in many ways, (2) [but now] in these last days He has communicated to us in a Son, [the One] whom He has appointed heir of all things, [the One] through whom He created the universe (i.e., time-space). (3) He is the shining forth of [the Father's] glory, the precise image of His essence, the One who [in His deity] sustains the universe by His mighty Word. When He had accomplished the cleansing of [our] sins [in His humanity], He took His seat at the right hand of the Majesty on high. (4) [And at His session (v.3), Jesus] became [manifestly] superior to the angels to the degree that He received as [a part of] His inheritance a Name so much more glorious than theirs.
Hebrews 1:1-4
There are numerous such verses in the Bible which directly state that
Jesus is God, and many other very sure proofs that He is as well (here's
a link to a list of some of them:
"Where does the Bible state that Jesus
is God"?).
I am well aware that the JW's NWT "translation" deliberately mis-translates
many of these verses. I am also aware that anti-Trinitarians have pat
answers to "explain" why what the Bible says is not what the Bible
means. However, any fair minded person who was not a believer and had no
"dog in the fight" would readily admit, just after reading, e.g., the
gospel of John, that the Bible claims that Jesus is God.
(1) The Word [Jesus Christ] existed at the very beginning, and there was reciprocity between the Word and God [the Father]. And the Word was God. (2) This One both existed and enjoyed reciprocity with God from the very beginning. (3) Everything came into being through Him, and without Him, nothing has come into being which has in fact come into being. (4) In Him was life, and this life was the light of men.
John 1:1-4
Whether or not people want to BELIEVE what the Bible clearly states is
true or not is another issue entirely. But that is the problem with all
cults, the JWs in particular. Cults have in common that they use the
Bible for support, twisting whatever they need to twist ("to their own
destruction": 2Pet.3:16), to make it come out their way. What they do
NOT do is to read the Bible on the Bible's terms in order to discover
the truth – or let any of their members do so. If any one of them did,
they would quickly abandon the cult – to the extent that they accept the
Bible's authority, that is.
I also well understand that there is a great, negative, residual effect
for anyone who has ever been involved deeply in any false organization.
But with the help of the Spirit and determined study of the truth, Bible
reading, prayer, and attention to a good Bible teaching ministry,
recovery is possible. But the key is to BELIEVE the truth – and spit out
the lies of the past, not letting emotion, doubt, fear or any other
manifestation of negativity interfere with this process.
Happy to point you to other links. The major studies here are
BB 4A: Christology and
BB 4B: Soteriology, and for the Trinity,
BB 1: Theology – but there are plenty of other
email postings etc. which deal with this and related issues (see the
Subject Index).
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #13:
Hello again,
I am writing you this Email as I have been wanting to hear your opinions on a
ministry I have learned about a good while ago.
The name of it is ‘I Saw The Light Ministry’ (here is the link for it : https://www.isawthelightministries.com/index.html)
and they have picked my Curiosity due to many claims that they have made in the
past.
They seem to claim that many translations of the Bible are inaccurate to the
original meaning of the scriptures, That the Holy name given by God to Moses was
actually Jesus and not YHWH (https://www.isawthelightministries.com/sacrednames.html)
and go on to say that the concept of the Trinity has actually Assyrian Syrian
origins to it (https://www.isawthelightministries.com/trinity.html). While they
do Believe that The Son is God, They seem to deny The Holy Spirit (or Ghost as
they call it) to be God too.)
As you seem to have some good knowledge of many of the languages taught in the
days of Jesus, I’d like to hear your opinion on those claims.
Have a nice day.
Response #13:
The claim mentioned is just plain silly. Even someone who only knows
English would have to conclude that every translator of Exodus has
gotten it wrong or is trying to deceive us – or that we don't actually
have "the real Bible". None of these canards is true.
If you go to Harvard or the University of Chicago or UCLA, etc., and
visit any one of their language departments, you will find world-class
scholars who know languages (most any language you would be interested
in) to a degree that far exceeds anyone in the ministry you ask about.
But I doubt if you'd find a single believer there. Knowledge of
languages is a tool. But any tool can be misused. If this ministry you
ask about doesn't believe that the Spirit is God then it is not
accepting of the truth of scripture and so it is of little use (Gen.1:2;
Ps.139:7; Acts 5:3-4; 1Cor.12:11; and compare Heb.3:7-11 with Ps.95:7-11
where the Lord is speaking).
Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.
2nd Corinthians 3:17 NIV
And we all, who with unveiled faces contemplate the Lord's glory, are being transformed into his image with ever-increasing glory, which comes from the Lord, who is the Spirit.
2nd Corinthians 3:18 NIV
There are only a handful of Bible ministries online I recommend.
Ichthys, of course, but also
Bible Academy and
BibleDocs (at the links).
I can also tell you that if you want to get anywhere spiritually, you'll
never do it by 1) focusing on a single issue that concerns you to the
exclusion of the whole realm of biblical truth, and/or 2) bouncing from
one internet site to the other. Even if you garner a lot of information,
you'll never have confidence in it, even if it happens to be true by
accident. Only what you a) believe, and b) is also actually true is used
by the Holy Spirit (see the link:
epignosis).
To that end, I urge you to consider getting cracking with a Bible study
program through Ichthys. Either the
Basic Series or the Peter
Series are good places to start (see the links); I also recommend
keeping up with the weekly email postings
(link).
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #14:
Doc, why do so many people seem to believe "KJV Onlyism"? It's basically
the belief that the King James Version is the only "real Bible" left and
all the others are corrupt...some even believe their version is
"inspired by God". It's frankly absurd and if one has interest in the
truth of the Bible they'll look into it and see its historically and
Biblically baseless.
How do you feel on this issue?
Response #14:
Part of this is ignorance. As one person is said to have quipped, "If
the KJV was good enough for the apostle Paul, it's good enough for me!"
Part of it is arrogance. As if by embracing something comfortable and
well known and eschewing anything having hard work attached to it one
was being righteous in so doing. It is a case of "holier than thou" but
with the same misguided rationale whence that quotation originally comes
(i.e., Is.65:5).
Here are the facts in brief. The KJV is an excellent translation but it
is only a translation. The Word of God is the truth, and that Word is
the Word in the way it was originally written. The KJV was based upon
inferior Greek manuscripts and, as a result, suffers from a number of
problems that later versions do not. For example, the so-called longer
ending of Mark which is not original to scripture does occur in the KJV
because the one Greek ms. they had contained it through late
contamination (link). Numerous other problems like this. Add to this the
antiquated language of the KJV. Also, it is fair to ask WHICH KJV,
because there have been a number of "updates" over the centuries.
As mentioned, it's a good translation, but it's only a translation, and
no translation is perfect. It comes down to the fact, I think, that "onlyiests"
feel they are somehow fulfilling their responsibility for spiritual
growth by affirming the "sanctity" of the KJV. Sort of like Roman
Catholics who, not being saved in the first place, feel that their
loyalty to "mother church" is good enough for God. But believers are
here in this world to grow spiritually, draw closer to the Lord through
progressing in the truth and passing tests, and to help other believers
do the same through ministry. Being an "onlyiest" doesn't accomplish any
of that. In fact it is a severe hindrance, handicapping the believer in
question through focusing on unessential issues and then by definition
ignoring what's important (Matt.23:23). Here are a few links for further
reading:
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #15:
Hi Bob,
Interesting post 11/12/22. In the KJV version of Psalms 41:1, I read
"Blessed is he that considereth the POOR" But in the NIV, I read
"Blessed are those who have regard for the WEAK." In English, these two
are different but could be understood as a comparison. What did the
Hebrew word actually mean? Ergo, which version is more accurate?
A number of years ago, I had a group JWs come to my house give me a
Bible "study." They wanted me to open my bible and follow along. They
came to John 1:1 and read their rather unique version. I said, "Woah --
that's not what my version says. Their version had: "In the beginning
was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god." That
effectively ended the "bible" study.
Curiously, I discovered another way to end their visits. A couple came
out here several times. I tolerated the visits to avoid being rude but
at one point they asked if I believed in the Trinity. I answered,
"Absolutely." I never saw them again.
In reading this week's discussion on Melchizedek I was a bit mystified.
To me, John 1:1-4 says it all and is a complete explanation of reality.
(I always understood the references to Melchizedek the same as do you.)
In checking 14 John 1:1-4 translations, all were the same. Can I safely
understand all of those 14 versions as accurate translations? Jesus said
no one has seen the father except he who came from him, which means to
me all references to Jehovah or the Word but not King of Salem are
references to pre-incarnate Jesus. Is that a correct understanding?
If so, the JWs and some of other commentators are further off base than
I realized.
Thank you for your weekly postings. The questions, even those arguing
about how many angels dance on a pin and your responses help to clear
and sharpen my thinking -- many times in areas unrelated to the actual
thread.
BTW, it was interesting to read you used the word "chops." I haven't
really heard the word since I left music. We appreciated people who had
chops and could "stand up and blow jazz." I stopped using the word
because it mystifies people today. Thanks for a blast from the past.
I pray all is well with you and yours (and U of L is off your back.)
In our Lord Jesus,
Response #15:
The Hebrew word in Psalm 41:1 is dal, and it means weak, poor, deficient in strength and/or resources. So both translations are defensible. Here is a case where English words are more specific than in Hebrew and thus the translator has to choose one or another in the absence of a word which clearly straddles everything which might be meant by dal.
Yes, the JW's "NWT" has a lot of self-serving mistranslations. Even so, the truth mostly comes through (where they have not added or subtracted the word "not") for anyone wanting to see the truth. The Word is God, so in one sense, I suppose, "a God" as well (though it's not actually possible to even say this in Greek: see below) – at least when one understands that there is only one God if we are talking about God at all. Read in Greek, this passage states unequivocally that Jesus is God, the God, the only true God, a member of the Trinity as are the Father and the Spirit.
(1) The Word [Jesus Christ] existed at the very beginning, and there was reciprocity between the Word and God [the Father]. And the Word was God. (2) This One both existed and enjoyed reciprocity with God from the very beginning. (3) Everything came into being through Him, and without Him, nothing has come into being which has in fact come into being. (4) In Him was life, and this life was the light of men.
John 1:1-4
The effect of capital letters verses verse lower case ones did not exist
in Hebrew or Greek when the Bible was written since they didn't have the
latter until later on (there were alternative scripts but no capital vs.
lower case distinction in our sense where it makes a difference; that is
a modern device). So this distinction has no place in any of the ancient
languages we're concerned with, there being no such
distinction of meaning in the original texts. *Also, Greek does
not have an indefinite article, i.e., it has no way to say
"a/an" as we do in English. If I wanted to stress that this word was
NOT definite I would use the indefinite pronoun "tis/ti", but
that is not present here in John chapter one verse one. So the
translation "a god" is really not defensible on any linguistic basis.
It's just what they want the Bible to say to support their satanic
theology.
I'm not sure I'm understanding your question(s) in the next paragraph.
Could I ask you to rephrase and have another go? There's no mention of
Melchizedek in John.
As to "blasts from the past", I am finding in my teaching that now that
I have a majority "gen-Z-ers", most of my cultural references produce
blank stares. In my first year Latin class the other day out of twenty
plus I only had one who had ever heard of Longfellow – and a lot of
these students are English majors. Times do change.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #16:
Hi Bob,
I apologize for the poorly framed Melchizedek quasi-question. I was thinking
about the Melchizedek thread in Saturday's email posting. To me, John 1:1-4
explains everything. All references to Jehovah and the Word in the old testament
logically must be references to preincarnate Jesus. Melchizedek doesn't share
any references of the sort -- at least that I'm aware. The real question was,
"Am I thinking right?"
I've always been curious about Elijah, too, but never considered him an
apearance of Jesus.
That's sad about Longfellow. Given what I hear from older people (40+) Gen-Z
shares nothing in common with us. I once saw a Harvard entrance exam from the
1890s in which applicants were expected to know Latin, Greek and advanced math.
Today, most can't get along without their cell phones. I suspect you don't allow
them in your classes. I would hate to have my lectures interrupted with the
chimes and tinkling of incoming text messages.
Thanks for the explanations though they were somewhat disappointing. I just
don't deal well with ambiguities. Probably why I never had an aptitude for
languages. English is hard enough for me (as you've read many times.)
In our Lord,
Response #16:
OK, yes, I think you're "thinking about it" in the right way in terms of
scripture overall. I was explaining the passage in Hebrews to the
fellow.
Most of my students are good about not having the phones go off in
class. When they do go off, it's usually one of my non-traditional older
students who have forgotten to put them on silent. I have a number of
retirees in my classes. They are usually the best of the best – and
usually do get my obsolescent references.
Sorry to disappoint. Language "is what it is". No two are the same.
Going from one to the other is not easy, especially when we're talking
about the ancient ones.
Keeping you in my prayers, my friend.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #17:
Brother Bob
Hope all is well I have a question pertaining to God's grace. Why is it the
Western world definition of grace explains undeserved or unworthy. As I go
through the scriptures pertaining to Grace and never says anything undeserved or
unworthy. I get upset when I hear a pastor preach with Grace really means we
don't really deserve anything from God we are not worthy to receive anything
from him but because of his grace he does gives. Now as I go to the scriptures
pertaining to Grace I don't see anything claiming undeserved I will always seen
Grace God's great love for mankind. Appreciate your thoughts and your
understanding to this take care and God bless.
Response #17:
Reading between the lines here, I think what you have probably heard is the desire on the part of Protestants to make a firm distinction in scripture between grace-based salvation on the one hand, and Roman Catholics (and others) teaching that we receive things from God by working for them and thus deserving them on the other. We do not. There is nothing we could do to earn salvation, no matter how hard we worked, because anything we do is not acceptable to God unless we have been sanctified by Christ's sacrifice on our behalf in the first place – not that anything we could do could ever benefit God in any way! RC, Mormons, and many other groups do teach salvation by works, but the scripture says this:
(8) For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; (9) it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast. (10) For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.
Ephesians 2:8-10 NKJV
If we work so as to truly deserve something, that is the opposite of being saved through faith by the grace of God. Abraham believed in the Lord and that faith was "credited to him for righteousness" (Rom.4:3; 4:5). He was considered righteous by God not on account of doing "works of the Law", e.g., but because He trusted God to provide His salvation (Gal.2:16).
(2) For if Abraham really was considered righteous as a result of the works [he did], then he has something to boast about – but not in front of God! (3) What does the scripture actually say? [It actually says that] "Abraham believed in God, and [so his faith] was attributed to him for righteousness."
Romans 4:2-3
Thus, since grace is opposed to works in the passages quoted above and elsewhere in scripture, the point is often made that God gives grace/favor to the humble (Jas.4:6; 1Pet.5:5), that is, to those who approach Him in the correct way, seeking His mercy through faith, and NOT to those who arrogantly assume that they are "doing something for Him". So in the Bible, grace (God's favor freely given on the basis of Christ's sacrifice) and [human] works (arrogantly assuming God needs us and our effort) are mutually exclusive:
And if by grace, then it cannot be based on works; if it were, grace would no longer be grace.
Romans 11:6 NIV
It is important to note that this does NOT mean that once we are saved we should not exert any effort in God's plan for our lives thereafter. Far from it! All believers are called to grow spiritually, to progress in our walk with Jesus (which includes passing tests which are definitely described in scripture as "works": Jas.2:14-26), and producing a crop for our Lord through the proper functioning of the spiritual gifts we have been given. That is what is being referred to in Ephesians 2:10 quoted above, namely, the "good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them". So there is all the difference in the world between fleshly human works ostensibly "for God" which unbelievers do in wanting to work their way into heaven on the one hand, and genuine, godly good works which are given believers to do in the power of the Holy Spirit. The former is works; the latter is grace.
(1) So now that we have been justified by faith, let us take hold of the peace [we have] with God [the Father] through our Lord Jesus Christ, (2) through whom we have also obtained our access into this grace in which we stand, and let us boast in the hope of the glory of God.
Romans 5:1-2
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #18:
Hi Professor L,
How I see the founding: I think that a number of the early colonists
were genuine believers with strong faith. And that some of what happened
was indeed a spiritual destiny both in a secular and religious sense
(the Lord ordaining when non believing nations rise and fall and letting
nonbelievers take over, and the Lord ordaining when non believing
nations rise and fall and letting believers take over). Of course Pre
America America wasn't one whole country or tribe then. Anyway, I see
the Revolution as driven mainly by nonbelievers which believers may have
gotten swept up in due to no-good-choice situations kind of a thing. And
that there were genuine believers right after the end of the Revolution
and onward until now. I even think the spirit of those early colonial
believers lives on in some believers today (the pilgrim-willingness part
too).
I don't have a strongly held view on this though, just a sense. I
genuinely just want your, as an Bible and historian expert, opinion. Is
this view above wrong do you think? Or what do you think?
Hope you had a good Thanksgiving! I now know the basics of holiday ham,
and am thinking of trying more complex holiday ham for Christmas.
Response #18:
It's hard enough to judge the spiritual state of those we personally know. Much
harder to be definitive about people we've never met and only "know" through a
sprinkling of history we may have read. Personally, while it may be true that
people in this country back then were in general walking closer to the Lord than
we are now, I see no great evidence of that. Beyond all argument it is true that
people back then were much more law-abiding – by which I mean hewing closer to
what God expects of every human being in doing what is right and staying away
from what is wrong and evil in the world. Today, we're awash in evil. So that is
a difference.
This is all the more reason for those few of us who have any idea of what we as
Christians are supposed to be doing down here – growing spiritually, progressing
in our walk with Jesus, and helping others do the same – to be as diligent in
this fight as we can be. Because only by us "being salt" and the saltiest we can
be at that is there any hope of preservation, even in the short term.
(9) And [so] let us not grow weary of doing the good [work of God], for at [the appointed] time we will reap [our reward], provided that we do not give up.
Galatians 6:9
See the link:
The Judgment and Reward of the Church
Yes, had a simple but very nice Thanksgiving. Hope you did too! Back to the
(other sort of) salt mines tomorrow.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #19:
[omitted question about reading "fan fiction"]
I think I see what you are saying. It is hard to tell how much was real
when they mentioned God so much and how much was using that
self-servingly. Sometimes when I read Herodotus I get the sense he
genuinely believes in the ancient Greek gods, but other times I get the
sense he pretends out of necessity.
I am glad! Good luck this week!
Response #19:
Don't know much about "fan-fiction". We all have things we enjoy that
are neither here nor there in terms of biblical perspectives. I don't
see anything inherently wrong with it. So you're not a perfect Christian
in using all of your time for the Lord? Well, we all have room for
improvement.
Good point about the Greeks also sounding pretty pious – until you
realize that they are worshiping gods and certainly not God (Xenophon
was certainly in that camp of pious pagans, and Socrates too). A lot of
the founding fathers were pious deists who were almost certainly not
saved, so in this respect they resembled the likes of Xenophon, good,
moral people who are a benefit to any country – but that doesn't make
them believers.
It's a lot like this country today where a goodly number of public
personalities who have morally healthy positions are agnostics or RC's
and so are not saved either. The biggest difference in this regard
between the days of the founding and today in my view is that the
percentage of these establishment sorts is far smaller now than then –
and the percentage of "nuts" is astronomically higher. It takes a great
deal of "salty salt" to counteract the latter. So keep fighting the
fight!
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #20:
I was reading the Interior Castle, and the author makes a number of theological
errors. And I think this is why. Because instead of studying the Bible we are
creating this whole castle system of the soul that the book is based on. I mean
she was a nun, focusing on the Bible was part of their job, right? Anyway now I
want to go back to just the Bible.
I was hoping to ask your advice on something that isn't faith related. Not to
re-go into all the stuff in the past, I had a realization that I dislike part of
my personality and want to change it. Basically I am not very good at intuition,
but I want to be. And I asked chatgpt for how to do that, since I have a more
concrete and practical nature. And part of it requires meditation (just
observing thoughts, feelings, physical sensations without judgment), and there
were a lot of intuitive books. I don't want to be foolish and do something that
would throw me off the all, but also don't want to be misguided and legalistic
or something and not do something that isn't harmful, or maybe not do something
I do need. What do you think, if I may ask?
Response #20:
Re: "I mean she was a nun, focusing on the Bible was part of their job,
right?" I would doubt it. The RC church used to discourage Bible reading
entirely, and they still put the Bible on a level below the pronouncements of
Rome and the church fathers. They are more about works than anything having to
do with faith. Instead of learning and believing the truth, building a building
real or, in this case, imagined seems right up their alley.
On the other issue, as someone with zero intuition I don't really have an
opinion. What's the difference between that and, say, ESP, for example? It's
different if the Lord is providing insight through the Spirit, as He did with
many of the prophets, e.g.:
When she reached the man of God at the mountain, she took hold of his feet. Gehazi came over to push her away, but the man of God said, “Leave her alone! She is in bitter distress, but the LORD has hidden it from me and has not told me why.”
2nd Kings 4:27 NIV
Wishing you a blessed 2024!
In Jesus,
Bob L.